Is Atheism Dead ?

@divegeester

Sure this is your usual MO when faced with one of my checkmate questions.

Remember 😉

No. Don't remember.

Now, for questions which you have dodged for years.

If in the New Jerusalem you find out that it was true that Satan, his angels and the lost rejecters of Christ are in eternal punishment are you going to protest that you would rather be with THEM in the lake of fire then with Jesus Christ the "monster" ?

Will you decide that Satan the accuser of God, Christ and His believers was right afterall, AND decide you'd rather be with Satan in everlasting damnation where the truth is than with Christ in eternal salvation and the Holy City ?

After you plug your ears and bury you head and not answer we'll see who is the one here afraid of "pushback."

Dance!
Plug up your ears and dance for us.

@sonship said
@divegeester

Sure this is your usual MO when faced with one of my checkmate questions.
Remember 😉

No. Don't remember.

You don’t remember me asking you questions which you refused to answer?

Are you being honest sonship?

@sonship said
@divegeester
Now, for questions which you have dodged for years.

You’ve never asked me these questions even once, what are you on about “dodged for years”?

@sonship said
@divegeester
If in the New Jerusalem you find out that it was true that Satan, his angels and the lost rejecters of Christ are in eternal punishment are you going to protest that you would rather be with THEM in the lake of fire then with Jesus Christ the "monster" ?

It’s not going to happen because it’s erroneous made up nonsense.

@sonship said
@divegeester
Will you decide that Satan the accuser of God, Christ and His believers was right afterall, AND decide you'd rather be with Satan in everlasting damnation where the truth is than with Christ in eternal salvation and the Holy City ?

No.

Here again is the illogical, amoral incomprehensible nonsense you propagate. You believe and preach in here that;

- Jesus loves everyone so much that he gave his love for them.
- But this same version of Jesus will supervise the burning alive for eternity, of those who don’t have a saving level of belief in him.
- That this version (your version) of Jesus is glorified by this abominable deliberate eternal torture
- there there are being on other worlds observing this torture and glorification of your monster god
- and these beings will therefore be deterred from not reciprocating the love to your version of Jesus

This is the nonsense you propagate.
And you wonder why you get push back.

@divegeester

The judged dead being tortured "alive" forever is your made up nonsense.

That the negative aspects of the last judgment is "my version" of Jesus is your made up nonsense.

But if you are finally in the mood for concise to the point answers - "Is the Son of God" for eternity or is "the Son of God" only so temporarily until the end of the millennium.

Remember, you're willing to give clear Yes or No.

@divegeester

This list is Divegeester's idea of a gotcha wish list of accusations.
And when I write substantially to address them, he will probably complain about the length of the response as excuse to re-write again and again just to ignore my rebuttals.

Jesus loves everyone so much that he gave his love for them.

The New Testament says there are things which Jesus hates.
It says He hated lawlessness while He loved righteousness.

"But of the Son, Your throne, O God, is forever and ever, and the scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom. You have loved righteousness and HATED lawlessness; therefore God, Your God, has anointed You with the oil of exultant joy above Your partners." (Hebrews 1:8,9)

Christ loving fallen sinners is wonderful. But never think there is nothing that Christ hates. So we have to allow God to thoroughly separate us from the lawlessness that He hates.

This is enough for now. Much more could be said about the things the Triune God hates.

- But this same version of Jesus will supervise the burning alive for eternity, of those who don’t have a saving level of belief in him.

Divegeester calls Hebrews 1:8,9 some VERSION of Jesus, fabricated, imagined by me.

The Bible says all sin is lawlessness (1 John 3:4)
And the writer of Hebrews reminds that God speaks to the Son of God that the Son "hated lawlessness". His love for righteousness is one side of His nature. The other side is His hatred for sin which is lawlessness.

He is God incarnate as a man who came to be executed, cursed, judged by God, on behalf of those fallen human beings. Why? That He might totally separate them from the hated sin guilt and hated sin nature.

Some will refuse Him and refuse to be positionally justified or saved from the guilt and power of sin. Because God is holy, perfect, justice, He will not abandon His hatred for the sin that some people refuse to be saved from.

They will not have their names written in "the book of life". The Bible's "version" of Jesus is that everyone whose name is not found written in the Lamb's book of life will have their destiny in the lake of fire.

The word of God is clear that that place, that "lake of fire" is nowhere any human being should want to be. It is communicated in terms which are IMPOSSIBLE to misunderstand.

He went to the cross and became a curse for us that we would be saved from that eternal destiny of punishment. That is not my version of Jesus. That is the version of Jesus according to JESUS.

"As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, that everyone who believes into Him may have eternal life.

For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that everyone who believes into Him would not perish but have eternal life." (John 3:16,17)

The requirement there is that we believe - believe in, believe into the Person of the Son of God, Jesus.

That's enough for now.

- That this version (your version) of Jesus is glorified by this abominable deliberate eternal torture

I sympathize with anyone who is horrified or abhorred by the prospect of eternal punishment. I am not an unfeeling stone. I once tried to see things another way as a Universalist would see. I tried but my conscience would not allow me because the word of God was clear to me on the matter.

I too am horrified. It only makes any sense if there is a crime as the GREATEST crime. Apparently to reject the Son of God who died being cursed for us merits we go with the rebel leader Satan to his miserable ending.

"Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse on our behalf; because it is written, Cursed is everyone hanging on a tree." (Galatians 3:13)

This Person who died as a judged serpent "as Moses lifted up the bronze serpent in the wilderness", this Person is God become a man. And for His great love for us, the world - the people of the world, He died under the judgment of God, cursed.

He became SIN on our behalf under this mysterious and divine cursing.
God does not command that we completely understand. God commands that we believe in
the Son of God.

Hanging on the cross for sinners, God forsook Him. And under the judgment of God God the Son cried out "My God, My God, why have you forsaken Me".

We are not commanded to weep, though we may.
We are not commanded to be able to explain.
Though some explaining we may do.
We are commanded to BELIEVE in the Son of God.

This is the version of Jesus from Jesus.
This is the version of Jesus from the apostles of Jesus.
And they persuaded the world that this is the version of Jesus of the whole Bible.

- there there are being on other worlds observing this torture and glorification of your monster god

I have written a dozen times that I know not for sure that today anyone on another planet exists.

What is more pertinent to the point here is that the PRIMARY glory is Christ being "glorified in His saints."

"They will pay the penalty of eternal destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His strength when He comes to be glorified in His saints . . ." (2 Thess. 1:9,10a)

I spoke of the primary glory - Christ being "glorified IN HIS SAINTS."
I spoke of the secondary glory of Him destroying and vanquishing His enemies.
The secondary glory is like the glory God obtained when He swallowed up Pharaoh and his army pursuing the Israelites. They were judged in the Red Sea. And God says He obtained glory upon stubborn Pharaoh/

The chief glory God seeks is for Christ to be glorified in His saved saints - " when He comes to be glorified in His saints and to be marveled at in all those who have believed (because our testimony to you was believed) in that day." (2 Thess, 1:10)

What about the unsaved? There are two classes mentioned in this passage:

1.) Those who do not know God.
2.) Those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ.
"Rendering vengeance to those who do not know God and to those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ." (v.8)

There part is to be under the vengeance of Christ in His return.

"And to you who are being afflicted, rest with us at the revelation of the Lord Jesus Christ from heaven with the angels of His power, in flaming fire,

They will pay the penalty of eternal destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His strength . . . " (vs 7-9)

Some of them afflict the saints -
"Since it is just with God to repay with affliction those afflicting you." (v.6)

But vengeance comes from God here on those who do not know God and those who do not obey "the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ".

@sonship said
@divegeester
The judged dead being tortured "alive" forever is your made up nonsense.

So there is NO eternal suffering and your claim “the lost will glorify him in their endless woe” is incorrect?

@sonship said

I too am horrified.

No you’re not!

You once said that knowing that Christ will ensure that unbelievers will be suffering helps you forgive those who mistreat you.

You’re a nasty piece of work sonship.

@sonship said
[ I too am horrified. It only makes any sense if there is a crime as the GREATEST crime.

It doesn’t make sense AT ALL, on any level.

@sonship said
I have written a dozen times that I know not for sure that today anyone on another planet exists.

So are you walking back your claim that there are “other worlds” with beings on them which can see the eternal suffering and be deterred by it?