Originally posted by FMFHow could I have been evasive if I didn't know? I couldn't answer your question because I didn't know, but now that I know what 'worm' means I do know.
At least it has become clear why you were being so evasive for so long.
If this wasn't clear to you before is it clear to you now?
Originally posted by lemon limeYou could have said you didn't know weeks and weeks ago but you seemed to have some sort of mileage you wanted to get out of a contrived disagreement with another poster.
How could I have been evasive if I didn't know? I couldn't answer your question because I didn't know, but now that I know what 'worm' means I do know.
If this wasn't clear to you before is it clear to you now?
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Originally posted by FMFIf the only question on both of your minds has been if hell is eternal or not, I've already answered that question several times.
At least it has become clear why you were being so evasive for so long.
You've both evaded my answer to that question by not acknowledging the answer. Instead of acknowledging the answer you just keep on repeating the same question like a couple of parakeets.
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Originally posted by FMFYou have no idea what I'm talking about, do you. I've answered the eternal hell question enough times to know that you really don't care if I answer it or not... you're only interest is in keeping this going by repeating the question like a couple of trained parakeets.
You could have said you didn't know weeks and weeks ago but you seemed to have some sort of mileage you wanted to get out of a contrived disagreement with another poster.
Awk, do you believe in an eternal hell...
Awk, do you believe in an eternal hell...
Awk, do you believe in an eternal hell...
Awk, do you believe in an eternal hell...
Awk, I'm a pretty boy...
Awk, Polly wants a cracker...
Awk, do you believe in an eternal hell...
Awk, do you believe in an eternal hell...
Originally posted by lemon limeYou've been dodging the question for as long as I can remember. Now it has become clear why.
You have no idea what I'm talking about, do you. I've answered the eternal hell question enough times to know that you really don't care if I answer it or not... you're only interest is in keeping this going by repeating the question like a couple of trained parakeets...
Awk, do you believe in an eternal hell?
Awk, do you believe in an eternal hell?
...[text shortened]... s a cracker...
Awk, do you believe in an eternal hell?
Awk, do you believe in an eternal hell?
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Originally posted by lemon limeParakeets you say, hmmm, I prefer to think of them as crows. Parakeets at least have the virtue of being colourful.
If the [b]only question on both of your minds has been if hell is eternal or not, I've already answered that question several times.
You've both evaded my answer to that question by not acknowledging the answer. Instead of acknowledging the answer you just keep on repeating the same question like a couple of parakeets.[/b]
Originally posted by robbie carrobieI don't know about FMF, but I'm pretty sure dive couldn't possibly be as dimwitted as he appears to be here in any so called 'corporate environment'. It wouldn't take long for any of his co-workers to ask "Who hired this clown?"
Parakeets you say, hmmm, I prefer to think of them as crows. Parakeets at least have the virtue of being colourful.
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Originally posted by lemon limeMark 9:48 "where their worm does not die and the fire is not quenched."
This makes sense, but I've been unable to find any commentary on this other than what appears to be speculation. Possibly a Jewish scholar familiar with the original language and idioms of that day could shed some light on this... my google searches have only led me to what appear to be attempts at understanding it.
edit: Just now found something.. ...[text shortened]... at which incessantly gnaws the conscience; that which torments.
Where their worm dieth not. Mark 9.
Here's the eternal address of the "worm that does not die":
"2nd Peter 2:4… “For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment…”
If "hell" is merely the grave, then how could God cast the fallen angels into hell (Greek: Tartarus)? Angels do not die in the human sense. You don't bury them six-feet under. We clearly read that these fallen angels (i.e. demons) are reserved in chains of darkness awaiting judgment.
There are three different Greek words for our English word "hell" today: Hades, Gehenna and Tartarus. Gehenna is the Lake of Fire (Revelation 20:11-15). Tartarus is a special jail for demons reserved unto judgment. Hades is where lost sinners go now when they die (a tormentuous place of fire, torment and suffering). For a comprehensive examination on the subject of Hell, please read: A Biblical Examination of Hell.
Revelation 1:18… “I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.”
Here we see that death and Hell are two separate things. I always capitalize Heaven and Hell because they are literal places and these are their proper names. If "hell" merely meant grave, then there would be no distinction between death and hell.
Revelation 20:13-15… “And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.”
How can you argue with the Biblical term "second death"? Obviously there is a punishment that goes beyond the grave. The Bible teaches that lost sinners will stand trial and be sentenced to the Lake of Fire based upon their WORKS. Also, the Bible teaches that death and Hell (Hades) were cast into the Lake of Fire (Gehenna). This plainly shows that hell means much more than the grave. The Hebrew word "Sheol" is the Old Testament equivalent to "Hades" in the New Testament for "hell." Sheol doesn't strictly mean the grave. It can mean a whole lot more, and often does. Psalm 9:17 is a perfect example: "The wicked shall be turned into Hell." Obviously this means much more than merely the grave, because that's also were the righteous go. It would make no sense. The clear interpretation is that the wicked and all those who forget God will be punished in eternity.
Conclusion: The Bible contains an overwhelming amount of evidence showing that Hell is a literal place that burns with fire. Those people today who scoff and deny the existence of a literal Hell that burns with fire are calling God a liar. Either you believe the Bible is God's Word or you don't. There is NO middle ground.
"Beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ; How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts. These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit" (Jude 1:17-19).
http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Hells_Truth/hell_in_the_scriptures.htm
Originally posted by lemon limeOK, well I went back to page 41 of this thread. divegeester said the following to Grampy Bobby:
That's some memory you have... maybe you should try refreshing that memory by going back and actually reading what has been said in this thread.
A few pages ago when I was pointing out that your horrible belief in God/Jesus creating and maintaining an eternal hell, you said that it was "my choice" to either accept or reject the Person and work of Jesus Christ". Why does my disagreement with you equate to a rejection of Christ?"
You said this:
"Isn't it obvious? Most of us have this horrible habit of believing all of the horrible things that our horrible Jesus said about his horrible hell, when in fact we should have been listening to you. Can you ever forgive us for not heeding your words and following you?"
Are you seriously now claiming that the theological stance underpinning this post of yours, regarding divegeester's questioning of the existence of torment in an eternal hell, is or was "I don't know"?
Originally posted by lemon limeWell, OK. I went and looked at page 45 of this thread. divegeester asked you "So do you believe in and eternal hell, or not? Your answer was: "You may as well be asking if I believe Jesus or not. If your answer to divegeester's question, now, all of a sudden, is "I don't know", does that mean he may as well have asked you if you believe in Jesus and your answer would have been: "I don't know"?
That's some memory you have... maybe you should try refreshing that memory by going back and actually reading what has been said in this thread.
It doesn't add up, lemon lime. You've been so evasive for so long, and spent the time trying to insult divegeester [seemingly regardless of what he says] instead of presenting your own religious beliefs in a principled, clear and consistent way, what you are saying now seems undermined by your own behaviour.
Originally posted by lemon limeWell, OK then, so I looked at page 17 of this thread and when divegeester asked: "Please feel to correct me. Will there there be humans (in whatever form) burning in hell for eternity or not?
That's some memory you have... maybe you should try refreshing that memory by going back and actually reading what has been said in this thread.
You didn't say "I don't know", and instead you said: "What does your Bible say? Do you own a Bible? If you don't own a Bible I recommend the English Standard Version, because imo it comes the closest to rendering an accurate word for word translation into English. Are you now claiming, retrospectively, that this answer is consistent with your current "I don't know" stance?