Who does Not believe this ?

@sonship said
@medullah

So it is incorrect to translate John 1 in this way.

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

Now, if you propose that the Almighty God is not the Mighty God, you err. In the Bible, Jehovah or Yahweh is the Mighty God and Yahweh or Jehovah is the Almighty God as well.

The Mighty God is the Almighty God. They are one in the same.

God (capital G) denotes the almighty = Ho Theos.
The second time that God occurs is derived from "logos". Logos does not in any way suggest Almighty. Translating logos that was is incorrect.

Now as for the age of Jesus Chirst, the bible discusses his pre-human existence, saying in Colossians that he was "The firstborn of all creation". So Jesus was created.

A lot of Christianity's problems arises from who had their hands on the faith after the death of the apostles, which was Rome. They tried to substitute a lot of their pagan beliefs into the Christian narrative, hence "Christ Mass" - there is no proof that Jesus was born on 25th of December - quite the opposite in fact, a point that at one time the Catholic Encyclopaedia acknowledged. That particular celebration was originally the rebirthing of Saturn (Saturnalia)

The concept of the trinity is part of the Roman (and Babylonian) belief system that Rome tried to shoehorn into the official narrative; the definition of God as proclaimed by the Athanasian Creed does not exist in the bible.

A good book (but can be heavy going) that covers a lot of this stuff is Hislop's "The Two Babylon's" which was published at the turn of the last century.

@medullah

God (capital G) denotes the almighty = Ho Theos.
The second time that God occurs is derived from "logos". Logos does not in any way suggest Almighty. Translating logos that was is incorrect.

No. The Word is the same God as the God with Whom He was with.

Now I am no NT Greek language expert. But I did take a course with Dr. Eugene Van Ness Geotchius the author of "The Language of the New Testament" Charles Scribner's Sons. (we used the 1965 edition I think)

I am not fluent in Greek. But I recall him spending time to prove to us that alternative renderings of John 1:1 were less likely, if not invalid.

Now as for the age of Jesus Chirst, the bible discusses his pre-human existence, saying in Colossians that he was "The firstborn of all creation". So Jesus was created.

Here we have agreement and disagreement.

1.) Because Jesus was a MAN, I have to agree that He is an item of creation. God created man (Gen. 1:26,27). Obviously the man Jesus is a creature.

2.) Firstborn of all creation in Colossians 1:15 does not mean Christ chronologically was the first thing God created.

But because He is God in a man, a created man, man as an item of God's creation, He is the PREEMINENT of all creation. The Firstborn not in chronology but in preeminence.

A lot of Christianity's problems arises from who had their hands on the faith after the death of the apostles, which was Rome. They tried to substitute a lot of their pagan beliefs into the Christian narrative, hence "Christ Mass" - there is no proof that Jesus was born on 25th of December - quite the opposite in fact, a point that at one time the Catholic Encyclopaedia acknowledged. That particular celebration was originally the rebirthing of Saturn (Saturnalia)

I know this about the mixture of pagan religions with the Christian gospel. Alexander Hislop's book "The Two Babylons" was a help to me about this.

However, some people try to cash in on that to say the three-oneness of God was also a pagan matter. I think this is a mistake to try to spread that Constantine blanket of leavening the Gospel over the matter of the nature of God being Father - Son - Holy Spirit.

The concept of the trinity is part of the Roman (and Babylonian) belief system that Rome tried to shoehorn into the official narrative; the definition of God as proclaimed by the Athanasian Creed does not exist in the bible.

I am not going by a creed. Creeds may be helpful. But the pure word of the Bible shows God is one - and God is Father - Son - Spirit.

You do not have to reach for a creed. The pure word of the Bible tells us so. And the Christian who receives Christ has to realize that she cannot detect any separation between the Three. Though there is distinction there is no separation.

A good book (but can be heavy going) that covers a lot of this stuff is Hislop's "The Two Babylon's" which was published at the turn of the last century.

It is helpful as I said. Some of the creeds are also helpful. But the pure word of the Scripture has the final authority.

Do you not see that "We" and "Us" are plural pronouns and mean God (John 14, 17) ?

@divegeester said
I would ask sonship directly if that is your suspicion.
One thing about Caesar-Salad which is amusing is his propensity to forget who he’s signed on as which is occasionally highlighted when several of his posts get swiftly removed 😆

Aww, a solitary lonely thumbs down from the boy in question.

@medullah said
God (capital G) denotes the almighty = Ho Theos.
The second time that God occurs is derived from "logos". Logos does not in any way suggest Almighty. Translating logos that was is incorrect.

Now as for the age of Jesus Chirst, the bible discusses his pre-human existence, saying in Colossians that he was "The firstborn of all creation". So Jesus was created.

A lot of C ...[text shortened]... t of this stuff is Hislop's "The Two Babylon's" which was published at the turn of the last century.

Well said; and true.

@sonship said
@KingDavid403

Exactly what I just said. Ponder on that for a while.

So then there is nothing wrong with saying He is older than His mother and as old as His Father.

You showed puzzling alarm.

The Word was God and became flesh
Yes of course. When Jesus was born as a baby, did He instantly know that He was God?

That's a good q ...[text shortened]... God.
The given Son is the Eternal Father.

So why is it stupid to simply believe what I am told?

So then there is nothing wrong with saying He is older than His mother and as old as His Father.
God is one. It's stated in several Holy Scriptures.
What you are saying is, is that God has a split personality of three personality's; and, that He role plays with Himself that sometimes He is the Father, and sometimes The Son, and Holy Spirit. It's either that, or you are plainly saying that God is really three different Gods; who are sitting around having a pow-wow over earth and everyone on it and that they all agree together. If Jesus was as old as the Father, please tell us how Jesus can be the Father's son? God can do anything He wants; so for you or I to claim that we have some special hidden secret about God and that we are the only ones who actually know Him is nonsense. It also takes the form of attempting to play God in other peoples lives. God is ONE; and, God's Holy Word clearly tells us so. Again for the last time:
[John 14:7-9 NKJV] 7 "If you had known Me, you would have known My Father also; and from now on you know Him and have seen Him." 8 Philip said to Him, "Lord, show us the Father, and it is sufficient for us." 9 Jesus said to him, "Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, 'Show us the Father'?
God is One! Jesus was and is God Who came to the earth in the flesh to save us. Simple as that. 🙂

@divegeester said
Aww, a solitary lonely thumbs down from the boy in question.

Nope, it wasn't me. Must have been one of my alleged but nonexistent alts.

@kingdavid403 said
Very good. I am not here to change anyone's beliefs. I currently go to trinitarian churches; and, recently graduated from a trinitarian university with a bachelors degree in theology. Biblical Studies was my major. I totally understand the trinity theory; and, I know that salvation does not rely on ones belief in the trinity, or the oneness of God. I've gone to ch ...[text shortened]... I am a oneness believer, you are a trinity believer; nice to meet you brother. 🙂 God Bless, David

That was nice to read, David. Be careful not to let this forum corrupt your soul. 😉

@caesar-salad said
That was nice to read, David. Be careful not to let this forum corrupt your soul. 😉

Be careful not to let this forum corrupt your soul. 😉
lol, Thanks for the warning. It wouldn't be the first time a forum has corrupted my soul for a time; that's for-sure. lol 🙂

@kingdavid403 said
So then there is nothing wrong with saying He is older than His mother and as old as His Father.
God is one. It's stated in several Holy Scriptures.
What you are saying is, is that God has a split personality of three personality's; and, that He role plays with Himself that sometimes He is the Father, and sometimes The Son, and Holy Spirit. It's either that, ...[text shortened]... God is One! Jesus was and is God Who came to the earth in the flesh to save us. Simple as that. 🙂

God is one. He is the Father of all things
Jesus Christ is the Son and under God.
The Holy Spirit is the power of God used to guide the activities of man.
Jesus says He will send the Holy Spirit [not Himself]
They cannot all be the one and same entity.
They are all separate and distinct.
They have one mind, and one purpose
One is free to say that they are all divine.
But the claim that they are equal, or that God reincarnated and became Christ is incorrect, as is the expression that they are mysterious therefore taking licence to speak of them as one wishes.
The words of Christ is enough explanation and further analysis is unnecessary and leads to false doctrines.

@kingdavid403 said
Be careful not to let this forum corrupt your soul. 😉
lol, Thanks for the warning. It wouldn't be the first time a forum has corrupted my soul for a time; that's for-sure. lol 🙂

It is a weak personality indeed that allows an internet chat forum to corrupt them.

@sonship said
@medullah

God (capital G) denotes the almighty = Ho Theos.
The second time that God occurs is derived from "logos". Logos does not in any way suggest Almighty. Translating logos that was is incorrect.

No. The Word is the same God as the God with Whom He was with.

Now I am no NT Greek language expert. But I did take a course with Dr. Eugene Van Ness ...[text shortened]... u not see that "We" and "Us" are plural pronouns and mean God (John 14, 17) ?

I think that this is one where we will have to agree to disagree.

@rajk999 said
God is one. He is the Father of all things
Jesus Christ is the Son and under God.
The Holy Spirit is the power of God used to guide the activities of man.
Jesus says He will send the Holy Spirit [not Himself]
They cannot all be the one and same entity.
They are all separate and distinct.
They have one mind, and one purpose
One is free to say that they are all divine. ...[text shortened]... ds of Christ is enough explanation and further analysis is unnecessary and leads to false doctrines.

I cant believe that I'm actually doing this, but in the name of truth I must endorse Rajk's post as I would concur with the majority of that.

@rajk999 said
God is one. He is the Father of all things
Jesus Christ is the Son and under God.
The Holy Spirit is the power of God used to guide the activities of man.
Jesus says He will send the Holy Spirit [not Himself]
They cannot all be the one and same entity.
They are all separate and distinct.
They have one mind, and one purpose
One is free to say that they are all divine. ...[text shortened]... ds of Christ is enough explanation and further analysis is unnecessary and leads to false doctrines.

Your beliefs are fine with me. The main thing is that "Jesus is Lord"; and that we are to have a personal relationship with Him. Period. We will all find out the truths in our ends on this earth; and, our beliefs in the trinity or oneness have nothing to do with salvation. Personally, I'll stick to the Holy Scriptures and believe that God is One and the same being God; who came to the earth in the flesh as the Son of God to lead us all into His righteousness and life with Him forever.

@rajk999 said
It is a weak personality indeed that allows an internet chat forum to corrupt them.

Thanks for the false judgment oh holy righteous one. btw, I'm doing just fine. Was Jesus or King David being a week personality when they cried out:
[Psalms 22:1 NKJV] 1 A Psalm of David. "My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me? [Why are You so] far from helping Me, [And from] the words of My groaning?"
[Matthew 27:46 NKJV] 46 And about the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, "Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?" that is, "My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?"
[Mark 15:34 NKJV] 34 And at the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, "Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani?" which is translated, "My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?"
Was King David a week personality when he committed adultery by being swayed by Bathsheba's beauty? How about his cold-blooded murder of Uriah?
allows an internet chat forum to corrupt them.
What I am saying is, I have gotten angry and lost my cool in chat room forums before; and, that I have said unkind and ungodly things to others which I know God would disagree with. I've seen some of YOUR posts before also, which clearly show that YOU have done the same thing also; oh righteous judgmental one.

@rajk999 said
God is one. He is the Father of all things
Jesus Christ is the Son and under God.
The Holy Spirit is the power of God used to guide the activities of man.
Jesus says He will send the Holy Spirit [not Himself]
They cannot all be the one and same entity.
They are all separate and distinct.
They have one mind, and one purpose
One is free to say that they are all divine. ...[text shortened]... ds of Christ is enough explanation and further analysis is unnecessary and leads to false doctrines.

[John 14:7-9 NKJV] 7 "If you had known Me, you would have known My Father also; and from now on you know Him and have seen Him." 8 Philip said to Him, "Lord, show us the Father, and it is sufficient for us." 9 Jesus said to him, "Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, 'Show us the Father'?"