@divegeester said
James 2:20
Faith without works is dead.

Therefore the saved person is saved without works but their ongoing faith needs to be kept alive through good works of that faith. Being subsequently without good works does not mean they were never saved or will lose their salvation.

@fmf said
So you believe that the Bible teaches that Christians with "dead" faith are "saved"?

@ghost-of-a-duke said
“For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life” (John 3:16).

And the following really ends the conversation:

Romans 11:29

"For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable."

@fmf said
Yes, but just as there is no "salvation" for works without faith, there is no salvation for faith without works. It seems pretty clear to me.

@ghost-of-a-duke said
Is 'irrevocable' also not clear to you?

@fmf said
Sure it is, but I don't think that someone with what he or she may believe is irrevocable faith - because they read that word - is going to be "saved" without doing good works. I think it is pretty clear that this is what the Bible teaches.

@ghost-of-a-duke said
But this is what the Bible teaches:

"For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable." (Romans 11:29)


Are you certain you know what irrevocable means?!

@fmf said
I refer you to my previous post which addresses this. I don't think that someone who believes that their faith is irrevocable ~ and thinks that they are going to be "saved" without doing good works ~ understands what the Bible teaches.

@FMF

I think Raj did a better job at defending the position you are asserting. You seem a little wobbly.

@ghost-of-a-duke said
"I don't think."

Exactly, 'you' don't think. You are expressing personal sentiments rather than listening to what scripture actually teaches. Salvation is a gift from God, based on faith, that he doesn't take back. Good works are a result of the transformation that has occurred inside the believer.

@ghost-of-a-duke said
I think Raj did a better job at defending the position you are asserting. You seem a little wobbly.

@ghost-of-a-duke said
I think Raj did a better job at defending the position you are asserting.

@ghost-of-a-duke said
Salvation is a gift from God, based on faith, that he doesn't take back. Good works are a result of the transformation that has occurred inside the believer.

@fmf said
If you feel you have made your case, just bow out. There is no need to resort to banter.

@fmf said
Works with no faith = no salvation

Faith with no works = no salvation

Faith with works = salvation