How old is the universe?

@metal-brain said

I want proof that it is true.

You might get it one day, or another theory will be shown to be more likely, or you’ll die first.

You seem to be building up a head of steam for a conspiracy theory?

@divegeester said
At its centre.

You folks cannot even agree about whether or not there is a center of the universe.
How can anybody possibly know how old the universe is if you cannot agree on the big bang theory. Was there a singularity or not? Some say yes, some say no.

@divegeester said
You might get it one day, or another theory will be shown to be more likely, or you’ll die first.

You seem to be building up a head of steam for a conspiracy theory?

Don't be silly, there is no incentive for a conspiracy theory. Only people making up nonsense to avoid admitting they are wrong. Where is the evidence the universe is expanding faster than the speed of light?

@divegeester said
That’s the theory, yes.

The speed of light is constrained by the fabric of spacetime, the expansion of spacetime isn’t.

People have all sort of theories they cannot prove. Dark matter, dark energy and now this stupid theory. All 3 unproven crap.

@Metal-Brain
Ok, so we admit it. Over a hundred years ALL scientists have been totally wrong. So now what?

@sonhouse
Stop being stupid. I never said anything of the sort.
Why do people call those 3 theories facts when they are not? I was watching Story TV and they had some guy on there saying "we know the big bang happened because of the CMB proves it" and the truth is he doesn't know that. The CMB is not in one spot at the center of the universe so he does not know that at all.

He also said "we know there is dark matter because of how fast stars are going around the galaxy" and that is only a theory he cannot prove either. It is not even supposed to be normal matter. It is supposed to be non baryonic matter. Has anybody proven that exists?

If there are galaxies 15 billion light years away from here would that prove the universe is at least 15 billion years old or would you insist there is a center to the universe and the universe is expanding away from that center?

@metal-brain said
You folks cannot even agree about whether or not there is a center of the universe.
How can anybody possibly know how old the universe is if you cannot agree on the big bang theory. Was there a singularity or not? Some say yes, some say no.

You have to make up your mind: either cosmologists are all in lockstep in their thinking on the origin of the universe, or they are not. Yesterday you were decrying a lack of debate amongst them, and now today you're deriding the ongoing debate that is, in fact, occurring amongst cosmologists.

All you want to do is make yourself look smart. Somehow your sense of self-worth hinges on this. "I know more than the experts, 'cause I'm sooooo antiestablishment."

You're not smart. You're a rigid contrarian insisting on absolutes in a universe of relatives.

@metal-brain said
You folks cannot even agree about whether or not there is a center of the universe.
How can anybody possibly know how old the universe is if you cannot agree on the big bang theory. Was there a singularity or not? Some say yes, some say no.

I’m not “you folks” whoever they are in your mind.
So what if different sciences purport different theories.

What’s your point?

@soothfast said
You have to make up your mind: either cosmologists are all in lockstep in their thinking on the origin of the universe, or they are not. Yesterday you were decrying a lack of debate amongst them, and now today you're deriding the ongoing debate that is, in fact, occurring amongst cosmologists.

All you want to do is make yourself look smart. Somehow your sense of self- ...[text shortened]... "

You're not smart. You're a rigid contrarian insisting on absolutes in a universe of relatives.

Stop lying and being stupid. The debates need to be out in the open, not behind closed doors while people who are full of themselves say "we know there is dark matter....." when they don't.

Can you explain the Galaxy rotation curve with dark matter? No.
Dark matter alone cannot explain that. Either the laws of gravity are incomplete and we need to form a MoND theory to make sense of it or the measurements are incorrect. The stars at the edge of the galaxy should take a lot longer to make a full orbit around the center of the galaxy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galaxy_rotation_curve

I think your problem is that you do not notice contradictions. I do and I am not the only one. Do you really think I was the first person to bring this up? You are just behind the times is all. People did not come up with a whole new field of study called MoND because there was not a big problem with dark matter. Do you seriously think they are all crazy people on a wild goose chase?

https://scitechdaily.com/dark-matter-may-not-exist-these-physicists-favor-of-a-new-theory-of-gravity/

Are you claiming that every single person working on MoND theory is "not smart"?
Do you think they are all rigid contrarians?

@divegeester said
I’m not “you folks” whoever they are in your mind.
So what if different sciences purport different theories.

What’s your point?

My point is that some a holes are claiming theories are facts. They should not be doing that without someone there to disagree to let people know the science is not settled.

@metal-brain said
Stop lying and being stupid. The debates need to be out in the open, not behind closed doors while people who are full of themselves say "we know there is dark matter....." when they don't.

Can you explain the Galaxy rotation curve with dark matter? No.
Dark matter alone cannot explain that. Either the laws of gravity are incomplete and we need to form a MoND theory ...[text shortened]... y single person working on MoND theory is "not smart"?
Do you think they are all rigid contrarians?

When you get flustered, which is often, your reading comprehension gets even worse than usual.

I've not said one thing in this thread about dark matter, dark energy, or modified Newtonian dynamics. You're so preoccupied trying to burnish your self-image as a freethinking, undiscovered 21st-century Leonardo da Vinci that you miss things that an 8-year-old would notice.

For your information I'm open to MOND theory as an alternative to dark matter, as well as other theories circulating out there. I'm not convinced that non-baryonic dark matter exists. It could be that the gravity from matter in parallel universes can be felt in our own universe, so the matter is "dark" only in the sense that it's situated in a different spacetime continuum. Cosmologists continue theorizing and experimenting.

@metal-brain said
It should be a matter of debate among cosmologists. That is exactly the problem. We are not getting enough debates on the subject. It seems like a convenient excuse to avoid admitting someone was wrong. The facts do not fit the observations? Don't you mean "measurements"? Measurements can be wrong. I suspect the facts do not fit someones flawed theory. Rather than admit i ...[text shortened]... or first. These things are far too slow to observe. Try not to confuse observation with measurement.

Ho-leeeeeee crap!

Every time I read something you've written in these forums (especially in the Science Forum), I can feel IQ points wafting away from me on a cloud. You continually post some of the most ridiculously inane stuff I've ever read. I don't know if you somehow think you're the smartest one in the room, but you have got to be one of the dumbest people I've ever heard from. And please understand, I lived almost a year in rural North Carolina.

@metal-brain said
Okay. If there is no center does that means if a galaxy can be found 14 billion light years away or more the present estimated age of the universe can be proven wrong?

I once read an article that claimed that the universe was nearly twice the distance in circumference than the age of the universe. I pointed out that was impossible because if the universe is less than 1 ...[text shortened]... keptical. Where is the fargin evidence? I don't want a mere assertion. I want proof that it is true.

For the love of God, stop it, you're killing me.

@metal-brain said
Don't be silly, there is no incentive for a conspiracy theory. Only people making up nonsense to avoid admitting they are wrong. Where is the evidence the universe is expanding faster than the speed of light?

There is some evidence, which the astronomical science community are exploring.

What’s your point here?

@metal-brain said
My point is that some a holes are claiming theories are facts. They should not be doing that without someone there to disagree to let people know the science is not settled.

You don’t seem to understand how scientific method works.