What is the point of eternal suffering?

@philokalia said

46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”

(the one divergent translation is from the Aramaic Bible in Plain English, which offers:

And these will go into eternal torture, and the righteous into eternal life.” )

Matthew 25:46

Here is also a description of the process from 2 Thessalonians:

5 A ...[text shortened]... sting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might

Where is the ETERNAL TORMENT in that passage.
What is your language of your birth parents?

@philokalia said
St. Jerome's translation of the Greek of 2 Thess. 1:9 into Latin:

qui poenas dabunt in interitu aeternas a facie Domini et a gloria virtutis eius

Who shall suffer eternal punishment in destruction, from the face of the Lord and from the glory of his power:

http://vulgate.org/nt/epistle/2thessalonians_1.htm

Notice the verb here "suffer" which aff ...[text shortened]... nderstanding of it as an ongoing process and not simply a snuffing out, clarifying the whole affair.

Youngs Literal Translation often provides one of the better translations particularly if you want to see how the original Greek texts were written:

who shall suffer justice--destruction age-during--from the face of the Lord, and from the glory of his strength, (2 Thessalonians 1:9 YLT)

@kellyjay said
From the beginning even in the Old Testament God has given us choices for life and death, blessings or curses. We just never take Him serously, and the outcomes were always exactly as He said it would be. I'd be concern about your eternal life if I were you.

Deuteronomy 30:18-20 English Standard Version (ESV)
I declare to you today, that you shall surely perish. You shal ...[text shortened]... And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

How many people you think had access to the scripture from the time of Adam to now?

Your entire post is utter church nonsense and is a clear demonstration of how church doctrines have messed up your mind and your ability to reason.

@philokalia said
Lol, you haven't done anything effective here and now skirt the question.

You failed to prove my position wrong, and now you won't even argue for your position on the topic.

Tail between your legs.

You'd rather talk about a conspiracy theory about some stupid post that allegedly shows I'm some horrible hypocrite (which I am) and I'm trying to conceal it.

Geez, LOUISE!

If I could roll my eyes at your response any harder my pupils would fall out.

You don’t have a “position” as such do you?

Your contributions in this thread are peppered with contradictions against the literal interpretation of Revelation which you seem to hold to and you have not been able to provide any coherent insight into the the whole point of eternal suffering.

@fmf said
If he consciously created human beings simply in order to torture them after they die for their human nature, then that would make your God figure "fair"?

And so, you are "glad he isn't fair"?

Do you ever read this contorted stuff back to yourself and reflect?

The man lacks the ability to think clearly.

@kellyjay said
Well, Jesus told us that we should be and its a healthy thing to do for a couple of reasons the first knowing who He is and what He is like helps us keep life in a proper perspective on how we are to behave. Do we attack one another or show grace, do we rush to sin thinking no big deal or walk worthy of the Lord God?

You are not interest in what God should do with people ...[text shortened]... , and complain about what God said He is going to do with evil people, you denial falls on its face.

I understand that my view on this is not palatable to yourself and other believers in the god who torture people for eternity for no apparent reason other than being offended by their sin.

I am inviting you to present a rational case supporting the point of carrying out this abominable deliberate torture, and you cannot provide one. All I hear from you is this constant regurgitation about god being holy and righteous etc and people being SO evil etc. It’s utter nonsense that you have been fed for decades and you find yourself unable to U-turn on it despite your inability to provide any sort of coherent justification for it.

@rajk999 said
English must be your second language. Where in that passage it says or implies that the soul is immortal?

You didn't apparently cover the Fr. Farley portion which deals with the souls willed to immortality by God even if they are not immortal by their nature.

What sort of little man turns into this kind of ranting after I up voted him and pointed out that he had led me to an interesting new area I hadn't looked at before? Lol.

Bruh, you might want to modify your tone a little bit because this singularly interesting part you've pointed out that I was unaware of doesn't make up for your routine heresy.

@rajk999 said
English must be your second language. Where in that passage it says or implies that the soul is immortal?

Now, of course, it should be absolutely clear what is meant by the soul being Immortal now. The soul may not necessarily be a mortal in and of itself but it is Immortal as it is real by got to be immortal because eternal life is really giving out to those who believe.

@kellyjay said
I didn't pull this out of thin air and I have given scripture for the doctrine, you want to say its a metaphoric, basically suggesting the scripture does not clearly mean what it clearly says. The wrath of God is as terrifying as His Mercy is great, you pick and choose what parts of God and scripture you like, you are not getting the full picture instead you are making it up ...[text shortened]... turning the truth into a lie of your own making. A very dangerous thing to do with the Word of God.

I’m not intimidated by your threats and warnings KellyJay. I have been a Christian for about 30 years and I have absolutely no problem processing the book of Revelation and all the dream-state visions of hellfire and torture and anger and smoke and burning and wrath...as metaphorical.

I will not be worshiping a god who keeps people alive and tortures them forever in order to satisfy “his holiness”. You chose to do that and that is your choice.

Jesus and the full atonement is the solution to the dilemma I see you in.

@rajk999 said
Youngs Literal Translation often provides one of the better translations particularly if you want to see how the original Greek texts were written:

who shall suffer justice--destruction age-during--from the face of the Lord, and from the glory of his strength, (2 Thessalonians 1:9 YLT)

Who do you think actually provides a better interpretation of the scriptures. Some Protestant looking backwards into it, or a saint who was a thousand years closer to the originals?

Do you really think you can come up with zany explanations for these passages that only makes sense in subsequently invented Protestant interpretations that are always looking for some way a reading their view into the Bible?

I am not even sure if you even have the vaguely rational Mainline Protestant views. Just tell me what you're trying to do.

@divegeester said
I’m not intimidated by your threats and warnings KellyJay. I have been a Christian for about 30 years and I have absolutely no problem processing the book of Revelation and all the dream-state visions of hellfire and torture and anger and smoke and burning and wrath...as metaphorical.

I will not be worshiping a god who keeps people alive and tortures them forever in o ...[text shortened]... nd that is your choice.

Jesus and the full atonement is the solution to the dilemma I see you in.

So you actively have to be providing revolutionary interpretations of all this text and also dismissed huge portions of food in order to make the Bible conform to your worldview.

You haven't shows soul of Christ, you chose me to love the world. You're doing everything that you can't fit Christ into your interpretation of what he should be to please the world.

And you're going to find out just like all the anglicans and all the sects that have gone as far as they can to the left that they're gospel does not persevere in the least. Go to a Unitarian Universalist Church and tell me how healthy they are.

@divegeester said
You don’t have a “position” as such do you?

Your contributions in this thread are peppered with contradictions against the literal interpretation of Revelation which you seem to hold to and you have not been able to provide any coherent insight into the the whole point of eternal suffering.

You are a Christian who has no idea how to consistently read the fine and you're telling me about interpretation? That is certainly rich.

@philokalia said
You didn't apparently cover the Fr. Farley portion which deals with the souls willed to immortality by God even if they are not immortal by their nature.

What sort of little man turns into this kind of ranting after I up voted him and pointed out that he had led me to an interesting new area I hadn't looked at before? Lol.

Bruh, you might want to modify your tone a ...[text shortened]... interesting part you've pointed out that I was unaware of doesn't make up for your routine heresy.

WHAT ???!! Are you right in your head? You are the fool that goes around here calling people heretic because they do not support your church nonsense.

Let me tell you
- your doctrine of the eternal soul is unbiblical and fabricated
- your doctrine of eternal torment is an insult to the very God in which you claim to believe
- your church has gone very far astray from the teachings of Christ.

As for you just finding out anything, you are a liar. I have pointed out to you before this very same 'immortal soul' matter several times in different threads and you ignored me.

-

@rajk999 said
The man lacks the ability to think clearly.

Philokalia - about 3-4 months ago - picked KellyJay out as one of the great thinkers and writers in this community.

@philokalia said
Who do you think actually provides a better interpretation of the scriptures. Some Protestant looking backwards into it, or a saint who was a thousand years closer to the originals?

"A saint"? I take it that Appeals to Authority like this one work on you, intellectually speaking?