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I think a recognition of the fact that we all die ~ and then, in light of that, looking at the opportunity that a finite life presents and embracing it with passion and wonder
Some of embrace with wonder that Someone overcame death - Jesus Christ.
And we embrace with wonder His life that He lived and words and deeds He performed.
~ is more "positive" than "expectations" and aspirations for immortality,
Some of us are impressed with Christ's victory over death to show life is indestructible when it is one with God.
And we are impressed with explanations as to the WHYs of death and the conquering of death in a historical Person.
And His words of His ongoing availability to men and women down through the ages is as time tested as possible.
He said "Behold I with you always, even to the consummation of the age."
We find that important and true.
especially if you cannot show how those "expectations" actually enhance one's embrace of life
All around the globe are the enhanced lives of communities of believers in all the four continents.
This reveals the durability or the truth and the relevance of the truth to many different cultures.
We're not waiting around for the approval of a lost Atheist like yourself.
- while you are still alive -
Christ is 100% rich and relevant to victory today.
Your daydream is that atheism is somehow more pragmatic.
which of course you never talk about,
I talk about the enjoyment of Christ for today.
As a matter of fact all that the New Jerusalem is in eternity the believer may have a foretaste of today.
I have written that the Holy Spirit is the pledge, the down payment and guarantee of a fuller enjoyment and supply that we may have today.
It is a lie that I have not written about the relevant TODAY Christ.
because walk-the-walk is anathema to you
No it is not. Today we Christians should be every bit in the foretaste of a fuller taste to be had in the future.
I've written much about that.
You're blind and can't see it because inordinate self love and self justification has rendered your conscience dull and your heart towards God hard.
- and because all you have is ideology ideology ideology ideology and an arid lack of joie de vivre.
I think you suffer from depression and blame it on a Christian like myself.
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30 Apr 19
1 edit
The OP is merely a regurgitation of a Witness Lee idea. But you somehow got the "City of Water" phrase central to it from someone else and not him?
Let me know if embracement for using a phrase I heard Witness Lee use is suppose to come crashing down and crushing me with guilt or something.
When is this suppose to occur ? I've been waiting for this traumatic experience now for YEARS from you and Divegeester's dire warnings. When is it suppose to hit me like a ton of bricks that repeating what Lee used as a phrase is harmful to one's health?
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30 Apr 19
2 edits
Penalty - Thirty Nine lashes with a wet noodle for using a phrase that Witness Lee used.
Since these guys are so intent to see the "city of water" in passages before I echoed it, let me see if I can find an instance in which it is in one of Witness Lee's messages:
Bingo From The Spirit in the Epistles by W. Lee [my bolding]
Revelation Revealing Two Issues by the Seven Spirits
The book of Revelation reveals two issues of God's judgment. One issue is the lake of fire (Rev. 20:15), and the other issue is a city of water (21:2; 22:1). Both of these issues come out of the seven Spirits. Whatever will be burned and consumed will go to the lake of fire, and whatever will be approved will come into the city of water. Daniel 7:9 says, “I watched / Until thrones were set, / And the Ancient of Days sat down. / His clothing was like white snow, / And the hair of His head was like pure wool; / His throne was flames of fire, / Its wheels, burning fire.” A fiery stream issues, comes forth, from before Him. This is a stream of fire, a fiery stream, coming out of the throne of God. Revelation 22:1 says that a river of water of life proceeds out of the throne of God and of the Lamb. Therefore, there are two streams out of the throne of God. One stream is the stream of fire, and the other stream is the river of water. One is for judgment, and the other is for nourishment.
In the same book -
Today in this universe there are two streams, the stream of fire to judge and burn, and the river of water to water and nourish. The stream of fire will bring all the negative things—sin, the world, the flesh, Satan, and everything of darkness—to one place, the lake of fire, the “trash can” of the universe. On the other hand, everything spiritual and heavenly—that which is of God, Christ, and the Spirit—will be nourished by the river of water and brought by that stream to the city of water. Every house has a trash can, but there will be no trash can within the New Jerusalem. The New Jerusalem is transparent and entirely pure. There is no dust, clay, wood, grass, or stubble there. Rather, what is there is gold, pearl, and precious stones. None of these can be burned. We need a vision to see all of these very meaningful matters.
https://www.ministrybooks.org/SearchMinBooksDsp.cfm?id=2F8509CDE0
I'll see if I can find some more.
30 Apr 19
@sonship saidThis is all think the think not walk the walk or do the do.
I talk about the enjoyment of Christ for today.
As a matter of fact all that the New Jerusalem is in eternity the believer may have a foretaste of today.
I have written that the Holy Spirit is the pledge, the down payment and guarantee of a fuller enjoyment and supply that we may have today.
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30 Apr 19
@FMF
Don't tell sonship, but City of Water (and lakes of mercury) can be traced back 2000 years to the Teotihuacan civilization in ancient Mexico (along with human sacrifices and the like).
https://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/2017/sep/24/teotihuacan-pyramids-treasures-secret-de-young-museum-san-francisco
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30 Apr 19
@FMF
That's not your original phrase. Give credit and indicate who first talked about "walk the walk".
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30 Apr 19
@FMF
I am doing that now. But when I started this thread I only recalled generally that I heard the phrase used on an occasion of two over the last 40 years I have been under this ministry.
YOU IMAGINED that I had all the references handy and hidden away privately before I began to write.
Speaking what Witness Lee spoke is quite spontaneous to for me.
Let me know when the shock of shame is suppose to come down on me like a ton of bricks to the frowns of "plagiarism" from empty blowhards like you.
@sonship saidWalk the walk is a common everyday turn of phrase. I am not using my side of my conversations here to regurgitate content from a particular man's books and, on the back of that, trying to cast myself as a preacher.
@FMF
That's not your original phrase. Give credit and indicate who first talked about "walk the walk".
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30 Apr 19
After these four series of judgments, some things will go to the lake of fire, and some will go to the city of water. It is by this series of four judgments that all things in the universe will be classified as to whether they belong to the lake of fire or to the city of water.
Same book Christ as the Spirit in the Epistles
https://www.ministrybooks.org/SearchMinBooksDsp.cfm?id=2F8509CDEF
From The Spirit and the Body by W. Lee [ my bolding ]
THE LAKE OF FIRE
AND THE
CITY OF WATER
At the end of the book of Revelation we see two consummations, one negative and the other positive. The negative consummation is the lake of fire, and the positive consummation is the city of water.
transfusing all that Christ is into us to make us part of the city of water, the positive consummation. Hallelujah, we are not going to the lake of fire but to the city of water!
Lee used it in Practical Talks To the Elders
In other words, as we have pointed out elsewhere, in the entire Bible there is only one line to carry out what God wants. Of course, there is another line, that of the evil work of God's enemy. Yes, there are two lines in the Bible, but one belongs to God's enemy. At the beginning of the Bible there are two trees, and at the end there is a city of water and a lake of fire. These two, the city of water and the lake of fire, are the consummation of the two trees. The tree of life will consummate in the city of water; the tree of the knowledge of good and evil will consummate in the lake of fire. Between these two ends, throughout the entire Bible, are these two lines.
https://www.ministrybooks.org/SearchMinBooksDsp.cfm?id=2E830DCDE7
Somebody find out if this phrase "city of water" was ever used by anyone else in church history.
It might have been.
30 Apr 19
@sonship said
I didn't invent the phrase "City of water".
@FMF replied
Who did
@sonship replied
I don't know.
FMF said:
When you say you "don't know", on reflection, would you concede that saying that was a falsehood?
Sonship didn’t answer the question...
Sonship would you like to review and reflect on this exchange between you and FMF?
30 Apr 19
@sonship saidYou should perhaps post links to unoriginal stuff you like - or put it on a blog where you can delete unwanted comments - and then maybe just be a genuine community member here and talk to people, not as a self-annointed copy paster, but on the level instead. You don't renember people's names, you are unaware of what they post, or the threads they start, or what gender they are, or what vicious insults you've dished out. Just saying.
@FMF
I am doing that now. But when I started this thread I only recalled generally that I heard the phrase used on an occasion of two over the last 40 years I have been under this ministry.
YOU IMAGINED that I had all the references handy and hidden away privately before I began to write.
Speaking what Witness Lee spoke is quite spontaneous to for me.
Let me k ...[text shortened]... to come down on me like a ton of bricks to the frowns of "plagiarism" from empty blowhards like you.