@pb1022 saidJesus does not need your permission to do the following
I realize this post wasn’t addressed to me, but I’m offering my thoughts on it anyway.
I think people who aren’t Christians have good hearts. But a good heart isn’t what gets someone into Heaven. Forgiven sins are. A good quote I read a while back sums it up: “Good people aren’t in Heaven. Forgiven sinners are.”
How do you think someone receives God’s Holy Spirit? Isn’t ...[text shortened]... doctrine is not only false, it’s repulsive because it’s focused entirely on self and not on Christ.
Forgive sins
Give someone the Holy Spirit
Save people anywhere he chooses
Welcome a nonChrsitain in the Kingdom of God
Neither is Jesus Christ bound by the doctrine of your church or the teachings of Paul. Jesus has his own authority and He said
THOSE WHO DO GOOD WORKS GET ETERNAL LIFE.
So you can take your false church doctrine and keep it to yourself.
@rajk999 saidI didn’t say Christians, you have alter my words to complain.
You are the one making plenty assumptions claiming to know what is inside the hearts of people. You think Christians alone have good hearts and non Christians have evil hearts and will burn in hell for eternity. That is a sick and deluded doctrine and only fools follow that doctrine.
Proof that someone has the Spirit of God is their actions. I dont know peoples actions l ...[text shortened]... s. I dont know and neither do you.
You are the fool that claims only Christians have Gods Spirit.
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@rajk999 saidCalling people dummy and stupid, bearing false witness against them and then condemning them based on that false witness, saying they’re going to hell, saying they’re fake Christians, etc. - that’s all hate, and that’s what you do in this forum. You’re a very hateful and hate-filled guy.
Disagreeing with your nonsense is not spewing hate.
You really are this Romans 1009 joker who disappeared a couple years ago.
Who will you resurrect as next few years ?
You talk about following the commandments? Jesus Christ said to love God and love people. You can’t love either with that much hate in your heart.
You don’t exhibit the fruit of the Spirit at all. You’re still in the Old Testament trying to make yourself righteous.
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@rajk999 saidWhatever.
Jesus does not need your permission to do the following
Forgive sins
Give someone the Holy Spirit
Save people anywhere he chooses
Welcome a nonChrsitain in the Kingdom of God
Neither is Jesus Christ bound by the doctrine of your church or the teachings of Paul. Jesus has his own authority and He said
THOSE WHO DO GOOD WORKS GET ETERNAL LIFE.
So you can take your false church doctrine and keep it to yourself.
It’s no use talking with you because you just ignore Jesus’ words and you ignore the teaching of the Apostles. You’re still in the Old Testament, and that’s Ok, amigo, but nobody is justified by the Law.
“Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.”
(Galatians 2:16)
“I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.”
(Galatians 2:21)
“Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.
Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.”
(Romans 3:19-20)
The Corruption of Earth
Enoch 7:1-15
[1]It happened after the sons of men had multiplied in those days, that daughters were born to them, elegant and beautiful
[2]And when the angels, the sons of heaven, beheld them, they became enamoured of them, saying to each other, Come, let us select for ourselves wives from the progeny of men, and let us beget children
[3]Then their leader Samyaza said to them; I fear that you may perhaps be indisposed to the performance of this enterprise;
[4]And that I alone shall suffer for so grievous a crime
[5]But they answered him and said; We all swear;
[6]And bind ourselves by mutual execrations, that we will not change our intention, but execute our projected undertaking
[7]Then they swore all together, and all bound themselves by mutual execrations Their whole number was two hundred, who descended upon Ardis, which is the top of mount Armon
[8]That mountain therefore was called Armon, because they had sworn upon it, and bound themselves by mutual execrations
[9]These are the names of their chiefs: Samyaza, who was their leader, Urakabarameel, Akibeel, Tamiel, Ramuel, Danel, Azkeel, Saraknyal, Asael, Armers, Batraal, Anane, Zavebe, Samsaveel, Ertael, Turel, Yomyael, Arazyal These were the prefects of the two hundred angels, and the remainder were all with them
[10]Then they took wives, each choosing for himself; whom they began to approach, and with whom they cohabited; teaching them sorcery, incantations, and the dividing of roots and trees
[11]And the women conceiving brought forth giants,
[12]Whose stature was each three hundred cubits These devoured all which the labour of men produced; until it became impossible to feed them;
[13]When they turned themselves against men, in order to devour them;
[14]And began to injure birds, beasts, reptiles, and fishes, to eat their flesh one after another, and to drink their blood
[15]Then the earth reproved the unrighteous
Enoch 46:1-4
[1]There I beheld the Ancient of days, whose head was like white wool, and with him another, whose countenance resembled that of man His countenance was full of grace, like that of one of the holy angels Then I inquired of one of the angels, who went with me, and who showed me every secret thing, concerning this Son of man; who he was; whence he was; and why he accompanied the Ancient of days
[2]He answered and said to me, This is the Son of man, to whom righteousness belongs; with whom righteousness has dwelt; and who will reveal all the treasures of that which is concealed: for the Lord of spirits has chosen him; and his portion has surpassed all before the Lord of spirits in everlasting uprightness
[3]This Son of man, whom thou beholdest, shall raise up kings and the mighty from their couches, and the powerful from their thrones; shall loosen the bridles of the powerful, and break in pieces the teeth of sinners
[4]He shall hurl kings from their thrones and their dominions; because they will not exalt and praise him, nor humble themselves before him, by whom their kingdoms were granted to them The countenance likewise of the mighty shall He cast down, filling them with confusion Darkness shall be their habitation, and worms shall be their bed; nor from that their bed shall they hope to be again raised, because they exalted not the name of the Lord of spirits
Seven Archangels
Enoch 20:1-7
[1]These are the names of the angels who watch
[2]Uriel, one of the holy angels, who presides over clamour and terror
[3]Raphael, one of the holy angels, who presides over the spirits of men
[4]Raguel, one of the holy angels, who inflicts punishment on the world and the luminaries
[5]Michael, one of the holy angels, who, presiding over human virtue, commands the nations
[6]Sarakiel, one of the holy angels, who presides over the spirits of the children of men that transgress
[7]Gabriel, one of the holy angels, who presides over Ikisat, over paradise, and over the cherubim
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What is the book of Enoch and should it be in the Bible?
The Book of Enoch is any of several pseudepigraphal (falsely attributed works, texts whose claimed authorship is unfounded) works that attribute themselves to Enoch, the great-grandfather of Noah; that is, Enoch son of Jared (Genesis 5:18). Enoch is also one of the two people in the Bible taken up to heaven without dying (the other being Elijah), as the Bible says "And Enoch walked with God, and he was not; for God took him." (Genesis 5:24; see also Hebrews 11:5). Most commonly, the phrase "Book of Enoch" refers to 1 Enoch, which is wholly extant only in the Ethiopic language.
The biblical book of Jude quotes from the Book of Enoch in verses 14-15, “Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men: ‘See, the Lord is coming with thousands upon thousands of his holy ones to judge everyone, and to convict all the ungodly of all the ungodly acts they have done in the ungodly way, and of all the harsh words ungodly sinners have spoken against him.’” But this does not mean the Book of Enoch is inspired by God and should be in the Bible.
Jude’s quote is not the only quote in the Bible from a non-biblical source. The Apostle Paul quotes Epimenides in Titus 1:12 but that does not mean we should give any additional authority to Epimenides’ writings. The same is true with Jude, verses 14-15. Jude quoting from the book of Enoch does not indicate the entire Book of Enoch is inspired, or even true. All it means is that particular verse is true. It is interesting to note that no scholars believe the Book of Enoch to have truly been written by the Enoch in the Bible. Enoch was seven generations from Adam, prior to the Flood (Genesis 5:1-24). Evidently, though, this was genuinely something that Enoch prophesied—or the Bible would not attribute it to him, “Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men” (Jude 1:14). This saying of Enoch was evidently handed down by tradition, and eventually recorded in the Book of Enoch.
We should treat the Book of Enoch (and the other books like it) in the same manner we do the other Apocryphal writings. Some of what the Apocrypha says is true and correct, but at the same time, much of it is false and historically inaccurate. If you read these books, you have to treat them as interesting but fallible historical documents, not as the inspired, authoritative Word of God.
https://www.gotquestions.org/book-of-Enoch.html
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@pb1022 saidThe whole Bible should be treated in a similar manner, as 'much of it is false and historically inaccurate.'
We should treat the Book of Enoch (and the other books like it) in the same manner we do the other Apocryphal writings. Some of what the Apocrypha says is true and correct, but at the same time, much of it is false and historically inaccurate. If you read these books, you have to treat them as interesting but fallible historical documents, not as the inspired, authoritative Word of God.
https://www.gotquestions.org/book-of-Enoch.html
Hardly surprising considering the many writers involved and the subsequent humans who decided what to put in and what to leave out.
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@ghost-of-a-duke saidWhy don’t you start a thread on what’s false and historically inaccurate in the Holy Bible?
The whole Bible should be treated in a similar manner, as 'much of it is false and historically inaccurate.'
Hardly surprising considering the many writers involved and the subsequent humans who decided what to put in and what to leave out.
Do you really think so many people, many of them very smart, would believe the Bible is the Word of God if the Bible contained false and historically inaccurate information?
@rajk999 saidA rare thumb up from me. Enjoy.
Seven Archangels
Enoch 20:1-7
[1]These are the names of the angels who watch
[2]Uriel, one of the holy angels, who presides over clamour and terror
[3]Raphael, one of the holy angels, who presides over the spirits of men
[4]Raguel, one of the holy angels, who inflicts punishment on the world and the luminaries
[5]Michael, one of the holy angels, who, presiding over hu ...[text shortened]...
[7]Gabriel, one of the holy angels, who presides over Ikisat, over paradise, and over the cherubim