New world!!!!

Originally posted by Rank outsider
Ok this is important.

You looked up the definition of untruth, not lie. The definition you cite confirms that untruths and lies can be the same thing. It does not confirm that all untruths are lies and that the terms are synonymous.

We can demonstrate this easily. If your watch was broken and you were asked the time, and gave it incorrectly, w ...[text shortened]... ng which was untrue, you should retract your accusations of lying, even if it was unintentional.

In there case or Who ever was running the WTS at that time it was a lie.



Manny

Originally posted by galveston75
So you think that the Brothers at the WTS hid back in some dark room and conjurd up these thoughts and consciencely said something to the affect " we want to trick all we can with these ideas about those dates, we know it's a lie but lets do this anyway"?

?????????????

If they did this, what exactly would be the purpose of that?

Do ya think t ...[text shortened]... ctually listen and use your Bible with a true honesty in wanting to learn, you might get it.

I honestly believe the motives of Rutherford was to bring more followers into the WTS and of course more revenue streams along with increased membership. In and of it's self not necessarily bad but false prophecy causes many problems. Think of 1975 for example. People sold homes and gave up education and basically believed a lie. I don't think it was a bunch of WTS brothers either in 1914.


Manny

Originally posted by FMF
How funny. People responding to your posts on a public forum are "stalkers".

LOL it's silly how they apply these standards to everyone else but not themselves.


Manny

Originally posted by menace71
LOL it's silly how they apply these standards to everyone else but not themselves.


Manny

And why shouldn't we be upset and condemn these so called Christian religions?

First they have no idea who God really is. In fact the worlds largest so called Christian religion just banashed his name from their bibles.
On a scale beyound belief they have covered up as much as possible some very serious sins.
They have sent their young men and women off to KILL even ones, even of their own faith when that presents itself.
They support and back up all the governments of the world even the German army controlled by Hitler.
Should I continue?

Yes we are not perfect and when and if any of our elders are ever found gulity of some gross sin, they are not moved around from church to church in order to hide them. They will be removed and probaly disfellowshipped from the congregation.
You must really be unable to comprehend all the discussions we've had on this. Unbelieveable.

So if you can't understand the differances with the few problems we've had compared to the huge problems all the so called Christian churches are involved in everyday on this planet, you are truly blind and just spouting off.

Originally posted by galveston75
And why shouldn't we be upset and condemn these so called Christian religions?

menace71 wasn't referring to "so called Christian religions", he was referring to robbie corrobie labelling certain posters "stalkers".

Do you agree with robbie calling fellow posters "stalkers"?

Originally posted by galveston75
On a scale beyound belief they have covered up as much as possible some very serious sins.

If you are referring to child abuse, yes cover ups are disgraceful and criminal. But do you have any evidence that child abuse is any more or less prevalent among members of the Catholic church than it is among the general population, or indeed among members of your own religious organisation?

Originally posted by FMF
menace71 wasn't referring to "so called Christian religions", he was referring to robbie corrobie labelling certain posters "stalkers".

Do you agree with robbie calling fellow posters "stalkers"?

"Fellow posters"?

Is there a bond between all of us? Are we in such agreement that we can be referred to as "fellows"?

One could say that I "stalk" certain posters because I find them engaging and entertaining, and sometimes informative. Always challenging. No one has ever told me to stop replying to their posts though. Some, it seems, have stopped replying to mine. Others have tucked their tails and run. I've thought about doing it, but I'm not finished yet.

I need a distraction. 😉

Originally posted by josephw
"Fellow posters"?

Is there a bond between all of us? Are we in such agreement that we can be referred to as "fellows"?

I used "fellow" as an adjective. But even as a noun, as you used it, it means a person who is a member of the same group as you. I said nothing about a "bond" between us or being "in such agreement". The word "fellow" refers to being members of the same community or group.

Originally posted by menace71
In there case or Who ever was running the WTS at that time it was a lie.



Manny

Sorry I can't understand what you are saying here.

If you are saying that JWs made statements that they knew were untrue at the time they made them, then I have no argument with you using the term lie. The argument would then be about whether your claim is accurate and whether you have any evidence for this.

Are you saying that JWs made these statements knowing them to be untrue? If not, then please explain why you think they were lying.

Originally posted by menace71
I honestly believe the motives of Rutherford was to bring more followers into the WTS and of course more revenue streams along with increased membership. In and of it's self not necessarily bad but false prophecy causes many problems. Think of 1975 for example. People sold homes and gave up education and basically believed a lie. I don't think it was a bunch of WTS brothers either in 1914.


Manny

Even if this is true, this does not mean that anyone was lying.

Originally posted by galveston75
And why shouldn't we be upset and condemn these so called Christian religions?

First they have no idea who God really is. In fact the worlds largest so called Christian religion just banashed his name from their bibles.
On a scale beyound belief they have covered up as much as possible some very serious sins.
They have sent their young men and wo churches are involved in everyday on this planet, you are truly blind and just spouting off.

Although FMF has already pointed this out I feel entitled to also as it was me (amoungst others) robbie carrobie was refering to as posting "tabloid journalism" and of being an exponent of what he called "the feindish machinations -- of these forum stalkers"; albeit in his reply-to-someone-else-as-I'm-ignoring-apostates-(especially divegeester and FMF)-today way that robbie has now adopted.

So why are you trying to deflect the topic away from the focus as usual? Do you agree that I and others here exploit "feindish machinations"? Do you think I am a "forum stalker"? Do you agree with robbie?

Or are you going to try to dodge and deflect the subject again?

Originally posted by Rank outsider
Even if this is true, this does not mean that anyone was lying.

Everyone will make up their own mind about whether or not lying was involved. There is a stark difference between

- what was prophesied before 1914 and what was prophesied after the 1914 prophesy failed

- what they actually said prior to 1914 and what they said they said prior to 1914

Of course you can have a different spin on what transpired.

Here is a some info on the 1914 fiasco in a nice simple format

http://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/failed-1914-predictions.php

Originally posted by Rank outsider
Even if this is true, this does not mean that anyone was lying.

You can't be that dense? The JW leadership made these proclamations about the end of the world knowing that they really did not know at all. This is a lie. Are you a closet JW? Just come out already no big deal.




Manny

Originally posted by FMF
If you are referring to child abuse, yes cover ups are disgraceful and criminal. But do you have any evidence that child abuse is any more or less prevalent among members of the Catholic church than it is among the general population, or indeed among members of your own religious organisation?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_sex_abuse_cases

In the United States alone, over 4K



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jehovah's_Witnesses'_handling_of_child_sex_abuse

As of 2007 only 11 JW's.

Originally posted by Rank outsider
Even if this is true, this does not mean that anyone was lying.

I've asked Manny before to show me some kind of proof, any kind that Rutherford made that statement. I still have never seen him come up with proof of his accusation.