@fmf said
So you accept that what you are saying is subjective and not objective?

A subjective opinion has no single universally correct answer for example if you believe blue is nicer than red that’s just your opinion and there is no single universally correct answer to the question which color is nicer. However the difference is that to the question ‘does God exist’ there has to be a universally correct answer even if you want to label someone’s opinion on the matter as subjective. That’s the point that seems to be evading you.

@dj2becker said
A subjective opinion has no single universally correct answer for example if you believe blue is nicer than red that’s just your opinion and there is no single universally correct answer to the question which color is nicer. However the difference is that to the question ‘does God exist’ there has to be a universally correct answer even if you want to label someone’s opinion on the matter as subjective. That’s the point that seems to be evading you.

Your conjecture about whether your God figure exists is entirely subjective.

@kellyjay said
I am only speaking about truth here and that it is never relative. Don’t make this more than that!

Your truth, your personal truth, your opinion...is never relative?

@dj2becker said
A subjective opinion has no single universally correct answer for example if you believe blue is nicer than red that’s just your opinion and there is no single universally correct answer to the question which color is nicer. However the difference is that to the question ‘does God exist’ there has to be a universally correct answer even if you want to label someone’s opinion on the matter as subjective. That’s the point that seems to be evading you.

The fact that I might be right to reject the claims made by your 'revealed' religion does not make my rejection of those claims "objective".

@kellyjay said
I am only speaking about truth here and that it is never relative. Don’t make this more than that!

It's rather telling that the assertions and "arguments" you make with regard to your personal opinions on supernatural matters are so heavily reliant on a seemingly wilful misuse of the terms subjective and objective and relative and absolute as they pertain to perceived truth.

@dj2becker said
That’s the point that seems to be evading you.

I don't think anything is "evading" me. Your certainty about there being a "single universally correct answer" to the question of whether your God figure is "true" does not turn your subjective opinions into objectives ones.

@fmf said
Your conjecture about whether your God figure exists is entirely subjective.

Sure but in reality I’m either going to be right or wrong as is the nature of absolute truth which you can’t seem to process.

@fmf said
The fact that I might be right to reject the claims made by your 'revealed' religion does not make my rejection of those claims "objective".

The fact that you might be right or wrong for that matter points towards the existence of absolute truth. It truth were merely relative you would be neither right nor wrong to do so.

@fmf said
I don't think anything is "evading" me. Your certainty about there being a "single universally correct answer" to the question of whether your God figure is "true" does not turn your subjective opinions into objectives ones.

Sure, if I’m wrong. But what if I’m right? Is there any way for you to tell that I’m wrong?

@dj2becker said
Sure, if I’m wrong. But what if I’m right? Is there any way for you to tell that I’m wrong?

There is no way to tell if you are right or wrong which is what makes your truth currently fall into the classification of being subjective.

Eventually perhaps you will be proven right and at that time the proof involved in that proving will cause the truth to become objectively true.

Until such proofing and proving occurs all we have to go on is your behaviour which leads to some level of credibility which can be indicative and leading towards whether an observer wished to co-indulge in your subjectivity.

@dj2becker said
The fact that you might be right or wrong for that matter points towards the existence of absolute truth. It truth were merely relative you would be neither right nor wrong to do so.

Truth corresponds to its reference, so to say I believe in this or that is true, for everyone that I believe this or that it is the truth is not relative. Another can say they believe something different, and for them, that is true for all, it is not relative. If God is or is not real, the answer will be the truth for all, regardless of what they think about it one way or another. If it is 100 degrees outside, for all it is 100 degrees outside where I am, because where I am is the point of reference, no matter what it is anywhere else.

@kellyjay said
If it is 100 degrees outside, for all it is 100 degrees outside where I am, because where I am is the point of reference, no matter what it is anywhere else.

Unfortunately, in this analogy, there is no thermometer indoors to tell what the temperature outside is. Therefore opinions about the temperature outside remain just that, subjective opinions.

@dj2becker said
Sure but in reality I’m either going to be right or wrong as is the nature of absolute truth which you can’t seem to process.

None of this repetition on your part can alter the fact that you and I are only able to express personal, subjective, i.e. non-objective, speculative opinions about supernatural matters.

@kellyjay said
Truth corresponds to its reference, so to say I believe in this or that is true, for everyone that I believe this or that it is the truth is not relative. Another can say they believe something different, and for them, that is true for all, it is not relative. If God is or is not real, the answer will be the truth for all, regardless of what they think about it one way or another.

Thanks once again for your reiteration of the kind of stuff circulating in your mind which you use to convince yourself that your personal opinions about unprovable/unknowable supernatural things are somehow "objective". They are not.

@kellyjay said
If it is 100 degrees outside, for all it is 100 degrees outside where I am, because where I am is the point of reference, no matter what it is anywhere else.

Never mind the silly provable 100 degrees thing. If you believe in ghosts and you say there's a ghost outside and so we go outside and you say, see, here's the ghost, but you can't show me it, and I don't believe it's there, whereas you do, and we discuss it, outside maybe, or even after going back inside, and you talk about your belief in ghosts, including the one you claimed was outside, which I did not see... then all that discussion between us would be conducted by swapping our personal opinions and subjective beliefs.