Predestination. True or false?

@galveston75 said

True.

Partially true.

I believe some people are predestined to be saved.

But I don’t think anyone’s predestined to be damned.

Too many verses go against the idea that everyone’s destiny is sealed the moment they’re born.

Plus, it’s not (imo) fair at all to predestine someone to be damned without giving him the choice of whether he wants to be born.

@divegeester
Who is in charge of this?

@pb1022 said
Partially true.

I believe some people are predestined to be saved.

But I don’t think anyone’s predestined to be damned.

Too many verses go against the idea that everyone’s destiny is sealed the moment they’re born.

Plus, it’s not (imo) fair at all to predestine someone to be damned without giving him the choice of whether he wants to be born.

So ones who you say are predestined, what does that mean exactly?

Some references.

Ephesians 1:4-5
Even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him. In love he predestined us for adoption to himself as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will

Romans 8:29
For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers.

Matthew 22:14
For many are called, but few are chosen

Ephesians 1:11-12
In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will, so that we who were the first to hope in Christ might be to the praise of his glory

Revelation 13:8
And all who dwell on earth will worship it, everyone whose name has not been written before the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who was slain

@galveston75 said
@divegeester
Who is in charge of this?

Who do you think!?

Don’t treat me like an idiot or I’ll box your ears.

@galveston75 said
So ones who you say are predestined, what does that mean exactly?

Why don’t you just say what you think … teacher!

@divegeester said
Some references.

Ephesians 1:4-5
Even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him. In love he predestined us for adoption to himself as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will

Romans 8:29
For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the ...[text shortened]... been written before the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who was slain

How do you explain this?

“The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.”

(2 Peter 3:9)

Does that sound like man has no say in whether he’s saved or damned?

@galveston75 said
So ones who you say are predestined, what does that mean exactly?

That means they’ll come to a saving knowledge and belief in Jesus Christ no matter what.

@pb1022 said
How do you explain this?

“The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.”

(2 Peter 3:9)

Does that sound like man has no say in whether he’s saved or damned?

I don’t have to explain it.

The bible contains powerful compelling evidence that both predestination AND free choice exist in parallel.

Same principle with doves coming out of heaven, Jesus praying to the father etc.

I don’t need to invent a “trinity” to explain something which is written literally hundreds of times in the bible, God is ONE. Truth is it’s own reward as long as we recognise the highest principle. I.e. God is ONE entity irrespective of doves and prayers.

Same with predestination and free choice; we don’t need to choose between one or the other just accept that both are there.

@divegeester said
I don’t have to explain it.

The bible contains powerful compelling evidence that both predestination AND free choice exist in parallel.

I think you do have to explain it.

Explain how they exist in parallel - and how that’s even possible.

Edit: And do it now.

@pb1022 said
I think you do have to explain it.

Explain how they exist in parallel - and how that’s even possible.

I can’t and anyway not my responsibility to explain it to you. Figure it out yourself.

I am simply stating the undisputed fact that both are comprehensively supported in the text.

That is my position.

@pb1022 said

Edit: And do it now.

Shove it sunshine. You’re living on credit, don’t spend it all at once.