Originally posted by DarfiusThe bible only says pierced through the side. I would say that 99% of people know where the heart is. If Jesus had been stabbed in the heart surely John would have been aware of this & just written that down ?.
Do you honestly think a Roman solider in risk of dying if he let a prisoner down alive would 'prick' (in modern day English) a prisoner?
But the most convincing evidence that Jesus was pierced in the heart is that out of the wound came 'blood and water'. Due to loss of blood and shock, a protective, clear layer of fluid had formed around his heart, and it looked like water. John would need modern day medical knowledge to know about this.
I can't find any medical evidence on the net for this protective layer of water that surrounds the heart due to shock & loss of blood. Perhaps you can provide me with some independant confirmation ?
Even so if we say that such a protective layer does exist, it still doesn't mean that his heart was pierced, the spear could have only gone in deep enough to punctured the protect layer, whilst the blood would come from the muscles surrounding the puncture.
Did you read the bit about Myrrh & Aloes?
Originally posted by Jay PeateaAre you attempting to get us to believe that John had X-ray vision and saw the spear enter the heart?
The bible only says pierced through the side. I would say that 99% of people know where the heart is. If Jesus had been stabbed in the heart surely John would have been aware of this & just written that down ?.
I can't find any medical evidence on the net for this protective layer of water that surrounds the heart due to shock & loss of blood. Perhaps y ...[text shortened]... uld come from the muscles surrounding the puncture.
Did you read the bit about Myrrh & Aloes?
Sorry, the shock would have caused a sustained rapid heart rate that would have led to heart failure, resulting in the collection of fluid in the membrane around the heart. This is called a 'pericardial effusion and it also surrounds the lungs, called a 'pleural effusion'. It has the look of water due to being a clear fluid.
http://www.bobmckee.com/Client%20Info/Cardiac/Effusion.html
The spear pierced the lungs or heart. Either way = dead. Why would a Roman solider risk letting Jesus down alive?
Please, the conspiracy theories are sad.
Originally posted by DarfiusBut far more believable than a completely dead corpose leaping to life, saying 'how de do' and prancing off to heaven.
The spear pierced the lungs or heart. Either way = dead. Why would a Roman solider risk letting Jesus down alive?
Please, the conspiracy theories are sad.[/b]
Goodness, what a fairy tale!
Originally posted by DarfiusFrom "Arc of Time", by Bright Eyes
All men want to live forever.
In Him, we can.
I hear if you make friends
With Jesus Christ
You'll get right up
From that chalk outline
And then you'll get dolled up
And you'll dress in white
And you'll take your place
In his chorus line
And then in you'll come
With those marching drums
In a saintly compromise
No more whiskey slurs
No more blonde hair girls
For your whole eternal life
And you'll do the dance
That was choreographed
At the very dawn of time
Singing "I told you son,
The day would come,
You would die, you die, you die, you die..."
Originally posted by MaustrauserIf God existed, would it be difficult for Him to raise Jesus (or anyone) from the dead?
But far more believable than a completely dead corpose leaping to life, saying 'how de do' and prancing off to heaven.
Goodness, what a fairy tale!
If not, the evidence must then be looked at with the possiblity that this occurred, and the evidence speaks for itself.
Originally posted by DarfiusI imagine it would be difficult, cos he can't seem to stop any natural disasters occuring (and that has nothing to do with free choice), he appears to be happy at the thought of global warming destroying the creatures he seems to have created, and he appears joyous when his delightful creation man, is cruel to other humans. And he can't stop an aging pope in Rome from dying, despite the millions of prayers daily for his salvation. So in short, 'Nope', can't see your god raising anything.
If God existed, would it be difficult for Him to raise Jesus (or anyone) from the dead?
If not, the evidence must then be looked at with the possiblity that this occurred, and the evidence speaks for itself.
Originally posted by DarfiusYes, in four internally inconsistant sources which don't even agree on the day
If not, the evidence must then be looked at with the possiblity that this occurred, and the evidence speaks for itself.
Jesus died and the circumstances of His Resurrection.
Let's give three cheers for literalism!
Nemesio
Originally posted by NemesioFor some reason, I think you have less of a grasp of Judaism than Christianity, Nemesio. And that's scary.
Yes, in four internally inconsistant sources which don't even agree on the day
Jesus died and the circumstances of His Resurrection.
Let's give three cheers for literalism!
Nemesio
I imagine it would be difficult, cos he can't seem to stop any natural disasters occuring (and that has nothing to do with free choice),
Natural disasters cause people to get closer to God. It has everything to do with free choice, since if you've made a choice for Jesus, then you have nothing to worry about in death.
he appears to be happy at the thought of global warming destroying the creatures he seems to have created
Where do you get this idea? And I'd like a death toll of the amount of people who died in 2004 as a result of "global warming" please.
and he appears joyous when his delightful creation man, is cruel to other humans.
Need proof. If you condemn "justice" as "cruelty", then I submit that you sit passively while an intruder rapes your mother.
And he can't stop an aging pope in Rome from dying, despite the millions of prayers daily for his salvation.
What do you mean by "salvation"? Most people who are praying for the Pope believe he is saved through Jesus Christ. If you mean salvation from ill-health, then why would the prayers of millions cause God to impose on the natural laws He hates to break when the pope will simply go to a better place anyway? Your logic is confusing.
So in short, 'Nope', can't see your god raising anything.
Uh, in short? You've not given a plausible reason why not yet, merely more conjectures from people who have no concept of who God really is.
Originally posted by Darfius
Natural disasters cause people to get closer to God. It has everything to do with free choice, since if you've made a choice for Jesus, then you have nothing to worry about in death.
If natural disasters get us closer to God then why does God simply slaughter all of us and we can all be part of his little heaven...why the game playing by God?
he appears to be happy at the thought of global warming destroying the creatures he seems to have created
If he is omnipotent, he can stop global warming. As your god fails to act then by omission he agrees with what's going on. As for deaths caused by global warming, there are various estimates. The WHO gives some 20,000 in 2003. I can't tell you in 2004. Other sites give different numbers. See for eg. http://www.nrdc.org/globalWarming/f101.asp
If global warming leads to coral death in the Great Barrier Reef then billions of organisms (not just humans) will be slaughtered because of your omnipotent god's inaction.
and he appears joyous when his delightful creation man, is cruel to other humans.
Need proof. If you condemn "justice" as "cruelty", then I submit that you sit passively while an intruder rapes your mother.
These comments are logically inconsistent. I condemn your god's so called justice when it is cruel - such as slaughtering Medianite children for the supposed sins of their parents. I may well cause significant damage to the raping intruder, but I wouldn't kill the intruders children!
So nope - can't see any reason for you so called all powerful, omnipotent god raising any dead this week.
Originally posted by DarfiusYou must have a 'less of a grasp' of English if you think that the stone can
For some reason, I think you have less of a grasp of Judaism than Christianity, Nemesio. And that's scary.
be rolled before Mary got there (St John, e.g.) and then after she got there
(St Matthew).
You can close your eyes to the contradictions, Darfius, but that doesn't make
them go away.
Nemesio
Originally posted by DarfiusOnce again you show total lack of understanding of Jesus' teaching.
[b]I imagine it would be difficult, cos he can't seem to stop any natural disasters occuring (and that has nothing to do with free choice),
Natural disasters cause people to get closer to God. It has everything to do with free choice, since if you've made a choice for Jesus, then you have nothing to worry about in death.
he appears to be ha ...[text shortened]... eason why not yet, merely more conjectures from people who have no concept of who God really is.