Evidence please

Originally posted by @whodey
You can either say that this is a million to one chance, or the gospels were written to match the life of Jesus.

Which do you prefer?

Is this not a logical fallacy called a 'false dilemma'?

Originally posted by @divegeester
I’d prefer you to post you evidence here rather than tell me about it.

Read Isaiah 53

53 Who has believed what he has heard from us?

And to whom has hthe arm of the Lord been revealed?

2 For he grew up before him like a young plant,

and like a root out of dry ground;

he had no form or majesty that we should look at him,

and no beauty that we should desire him.

3 He was despised and rejected by men,

a man of sorrows and acquainted with4 grief;

and as one from whom men hide their faces

he was despised, and we esteemed him not.

Surely he has borne our griefs

and carried our sorrows;

yet we esteemed him stricken,

smitten by God, and afflicted.

But he was pierced for our transgressions;

he was crushed for our iniquities;

upon him was the chastisement that brought us peace,

and with his wounds we are healed.

All we like sheep have gone astray;

we have turned—every one—to his own way;

and the Lord has laid on him

the iniquity of us all.

He was oppressed, and he was afflicted,

yet he opened not his mouth;

like a lamb that is led to the slaughter,

and like a sheep that before its shearers is silent,

so he opened not his mouth.

By oppression and judgment he was taken away;

and as for his generation, who considered

that he was cut off out of the land of the living,

stricken for the transgression of my people?

And they made his grave with the wicked

wand with a rich man in his death,

although he had done no violence,

and there was no deceit in his mouth.

Yet it was the will of the Lord to crush him;

he has put him to grief;

when his soul makes8 an offering for guilt,

he shall see his offspring; he shall prolong his days;

the will of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.

Out of the anguish of his soul he shall see9 and be satisfied;
by his knowledge shall the righteous one, my servant,

make many to be accounted righteous,

and he shall bear their iniquities.

Therefore I will divide him a portion with the many,

and he shall divide the spoil with the strong,

because he poured out his soul to death

and was numbered with the transgressors;

yet he bore the sin of many,

and makes intercession for the transgressors.

Originally posted by @whodey
Read Isaiah 53

53 Who has believed what he has heard from us?

And to whom has hthe arm of the Lord been revealed?

2 For he grew up before him like a young plant,

and like a root out of dry ground;

he had no form or majesty that we should look at him,

and no beauty that we should desire him.

3 He was despised and rejected by men ...[text shortened]... ransgressors;

yet he bore the sin of many,

and makes intercession for the transgressors.

So in this text, we see a variety of prophecies that Jesus fulfilled. For example, he was born in the Tribe of Jesse, he was wounded for our transgressions, he did not defend himself before his death on the cross, etc. Naturally Jews discount this and say that the verse is not about Jesus.....but then......why would God wound and abuse a holy man as this man is purported to be?

Isaiah has been confirmed to have been written well before the life of Jesus.

Originally posted by @whodey
So in this text, we see a variety of prophecies that Jesus fulfilled. For example, he was born in the Tribe of Jesse, he was wounded for our transgressions, he did not defend himself before his death on the cross, etc. Naturally Jews discount this and say that the verse is not about Jesus.....but then......why would God wound and abuse a holy man as this m ...[text shortened]... purported to be?

This has been confirmed to have been written well before the life of Jesus.

You are preaching to the choir whodey.

Originally posted by @fmf
Is this not a logical fallacy called a 'false dilemma'?

If 12 men gave their lives for a cause, then they either believed in that cause or they wanted to get rich.

Wouldn't you say?

Originally posted by @divegeester
I’d prefer you to post your evidence here rather than tell me about it.

Edit; I believe that you have seen “evidence” that sufficiently supports your religious POV. But did that evidence cause you to believe or did you already believe? I’m betting the latter.

Whodey can you respond to the second part of my post please? The edit.

Originally posted by @divegeester
You are preaching to the choir whodey.

Jesus said to look to the prophets as a resume for evidence as to who and what he is, did he not?

Originally posted by @whodey
If 12 men gave their lives for a cause, then they either believed in that cause or they wanted to get rich.

Wouldn't you say?

Was not the question you asked a logical fallacy called a 'false dilemma'?

Originally posted by @whodey
If 12 men gave their lives for a cause, then they either believed in that cause or they wanted to get rich.

Wouldn't you say?

Or they were deluded. Terrorists give their lives for their cause and they don’t want money.

Originally posted by @divegeester
I’d prefer you to post your evidence here rather than tell me about it.

Edit; I believe that you have seen “evidence” that sufficiently supports your religious POV. But did that evidence cause you to believe or did you already believe? I’m betting the latter.

It was the later ,but in the case of the man in the Case for Christ, it was not.

I hope you are not saying he is lying.

Originally posted by @whodey
Jesus said to look to the prophets as a resume for evidence as to who and what he is, did he not?

Yes he did. He said this to the Hebrews who were already believers in god and accepted Isaiah as evidence. It was a matter of spiritual revelation for them to see Jesus in their own writings.

Try that methodology down the pub.

Originally posted by @whodey
It was the later ,but in the case of the man in the Case for Christ, it was not.

I hope you are not saying he is lying.

No, (sigh), I’m saying you were already a believer and didn’t need evidence. Like me.

Originally posted by @divegeester
Or they were deluded. Terrorists give their lives for their cause and they don’t want money.

And in the movie their actions and teachings are studied to assess them on a psychologically.

Do you think they were deluded? Was Paul based on what he taught and the way he lived his life?