Originally posted by Suzianne"They do not ever show the love for their Christian brothers that Christ commanded us to have."
divegeester has his own mind. It is not up to me to either provide evidence for what he says, nor to attack what he says merely because you find it 'insufficient'. If I have a problem with what he says, I will, and often have, approach him directly.
By the way, this also goes for his assertions that somehow I must accept what other Christians believe b ...[text shortened]... . They do not ever show the love for their Christian brothers that Christ commanded us to have.
Lets make this as clear as it can be. We love all humans and it is for that reason that Jehovah would use us. If we didn't we would never be even slightly considered to be used and approved.
I'm curious as to where that idea you have came from? Perhaps there are other things you don't have the right understanding of?
Now to answer the point your claim, what is it about others that say they are christian but yet don't believe as we do and in fact condemn us as even you yourself do at times? Do we still love you and them? Yes we do and will do anything we can to help you see the truths in the bible. We don't go door to door to find other JW's. We go trying to find anyone that is searching for the truths in the bible no matter who they are.
But what clear advice and in fact a command does the bible give if we are not welcomed and they are not interested? Do we just hang around, become a close friend, have them over for dinner and play cards? No we are in fact told the opposite. But do we still love you? Yes and until the day comes that Jehovah says the teaching work is over, we will still be trying to help all that want to learn the bible and the truths in it. If we did not love all humans then Jehovah would have no use for any of us. This love and the desire to help not even in a just a temporary physical way but more importantly in a spiritual way, even at our own expense and time are the qualities he looks for in us.
Does this help in understanding who we are?
http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2010441?q=association+with+unbelievers&p=par
17 Mar 16
Originally posted by divegeesterI would ask you to look deeper than your own bias as to why I might do this.
You are consistent in this inconsistency; confronting myself, Rajk, carrobie, and FMF, but NEVER sonship, GB, josephw or the rest of your in-group.
My "in-group", as you call them, all have similar beliefs as my own, and the differences are minor points of doctrine (despite *your* opinion as to the gravity of what I am calling minor points), while the first group you mentioned, including you, have what I and the others consider "fringe" doctrines, certainly not in the mainstream of modern Christian thought. It all seems to be a matter of degree. We simply don't agree on which points of doctrine are worth arguing about. Your set of doctrinal differences that you are willing to "go to the mat" over are very different from my set. And that's where all the difference lies.
17 Mar 16
Originally posted by galveston75G-man, my main beef with the JWs boils down to the fact that you guys don't think any people who call themselves Christian, and who are not JWs, are Christian at all, and according to you guys, if you're not JWs, then you're not even saved. This is a level of disrespect that no other denomination engages in. And this is certainly not showing love for your Christian brothers.
"They do not ever show the love for their Christian brothers that Christ commanded us to have."
Lets make this as clear as it can be. We love all humans and it is for that reason that Jehovah would use us. If we didn't we would never be even slightly considered to be used and approved.
I'm curious as to where that idea you have came from? Perhaps ...[text shortened]... who we are?
http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2010441?q=association+with+unbelievers&p=par
Originally posted by Suziannewho really are my brothers and sisters, the ones doing Gods will. - Jesus
G-man, my main beef with the JWs boils down to the fact that you guys don't think any people who call themselves Christian, and who are not JWs, are Christian at all, and according to you guys, if you're not JWs, then you're not even saved. This is a level of disrespect that no other denomination engages in. And this is certainly not showing love for your Christian brothers.
17 Mar 16
Originally posted by SuzianneWell another point you have wrong is that no, "we are not saved." ( Another issue that you are not correct on. How many others are you wrong about when it comes to our views on the bible?)
G-man, my main beef with the JWs boils down to the fact that you guys don't think any people who call themselves Christian, and who are not JWs, are Christian at all, and according to you guys, if you're not JWs, then you're not even saved. This is a level of disrespect that no other denomination engages in. And this is certainly not showing love for your Christian brothers.
But as far as that goes no one is saved, YET. If we were saved it would be easy to be as many are with the attitude that since "one is saved, then I can some what back off from my christian obligations" that again Jesus commanded us all to do that says their Christian. Matt 24th & 28th chapters
To be Christian is to be like Christ in all we do.
How many who say they are Christian will go fight in wars and probably kill other Christians? Is that showing love that you say we don't show? Hardly is it?
It is up to Jehovah and his son Jesus who determines who gets saved, when that time comes. If all Christians are saved only because they say they believe in Jesus and that's it, then all that Jesus showed and told us to do in the teaching work he commanded that we do, is a waist of time especially when it comes to speaking to other Christians, because in your view, your all already saved!
Question: Do you see no wrong in associating on a personal level with other christian's who believe different then you? If you could include a scripture or two that would back your thoughts on this, I would be interested in seeing them.
19 Mar 16
Originally posted by divegeesterYou know if you want to push it and get technical Michael the Archangel can indeed be one in the same as Jesus the Christ ( I know I'm now a heretic) But Michael means Captain of God or Prince of God and Angel means messenger..... It's not to far of a leap to say Michael the Archangel represents Christ as depicted in Scripture. The Chief Captain and messenger of God! Is that not what Christ was? ( Is still ) people get caught up on the word Angel but one should look at the original language.... This is not in any way to say Jesus was a literal angel like the beings created by God "the Host" or spirits..... There are examples of the word Angel being used in Revelation also when He says " To the angel of the Church write this" are we to take that as a literal angel? No
Three things I'm absolutely certain of:
1) Nowhere in the bible, not once, does it say that Jesus is an angel. Or that an angel died for my sins, and therefore an angel is my co-saviour and "Mighty God" alongside Jehovah who is a separate "Almighty God".
2) Robbie carrobie and roigam will not address this point.
3) You will soon disappear off ag ...[text shortened]... in another puff of domestic bat-smoke, bloodless foot-surgery and pouting righteous indignation.
Manny
19 Mar 16
.
However, the meaning of the angels is less plain. The Greek word angelos simply meant “messenger”; usually, the word was used for supernatural “messengers” from God. However, sometimes the word was applied to human messengers of God’s Word: John the Baptist is called an “angelos” in Matthew 11:10.
- Joined
- 16 Feb 08
- Moves
- 117396
20 Mar 16
Originally posted by menace71Being a "captain of God" and a "messenger" does not make Michael the messiah and no stretch of any scripture makes it so. You surprise me.
You know if you want to push it and get technical Michael the Archangel can indeed be one in the same as Jesus the Christ ( I know I'm now a heretic) But Michael means Captain of God or Prince of God and Angel means messenger..... It's not to far of a leap to say Michael the Archangel represents Christ as depicted in Scripture. The Chief Captain and messeng ...[text shortened]... s " To the angel of the Church write this" are we to take that as a literal angel? No
Manny
- Joined
- 16 Feb 08
- Moves
- 117396
20 Mar 16
Originally posted by SuzianneThis is deflection. You have a reputation for attacking those you don't like here; and those you don't like are those who attack your buddies. Pretending it's about doctrine is simply not supported by the evidence of your posting.
I would ask you to look deeper than your own bias as to why I might do this.
My "in-group", as you call them, all have similar beliefs as my own, and the differences are minor points of doctrine (despite *your* opinion as to the gravity of what I am calling minor points), while the first group you mentioned, including you, have what I and the others cons ...[text shortened]... "go to the mat" over are very different from my set. And that's where all the difference lies.
- Joined
- 16 Feb 08
- Moves
- 117396
20 Mar 16
Originally posted by SuzianneI hold to "Fringe doctrines"
I would ask you to look deeper than your own bias as to why I might do this.
My "in-group", as you call them, all have similar beliefs as my own, and the differences are minor points of doctrine (despite *your* opinion as to the gravity of what I am calling minor points), while the first group you mentioned, including you, have what I and the others cons ...[text shortened]... "go to the mat" over are very different from my set. And that's where all the difference lies.
The doctrinal differences you have with your buddies are "Minor points of doctrine"
Do you want to put this waffle to the test?
- Joined
- 16 Feb 08
- Moves
- 117396
20 Mar 16
1 edit
Originally posted by galveston75"We don't go door to door to find other JW's. We go trying to find anyone that is searching for the truths in the bible no matter who they are."
Lets make this as clear as it can be. We love all humans and it is for that reason that Jehovah would use us. If we didn't we would never be even slightly considered to be used and approved.
I'm curious as to where that idea you have came from? Perhaps there are other things you don't have the right understanding of?
Now to answer the point your cla ...[text shortened]... who we are?
http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2010441?q=association+with+unbelievers&p=par
This is quite disingenuous of you. You go door to door looking for people to join your religion - to claim or insinuate otherwise is simply not the truth.
Originally posted by galveston75Originally posted by galveston75
Yep. Many call themselves brothers and sisters in the faith, but Jesus said to get away from him. They are not doing the work he told them to do.....
What must we do to avoid false teachers? We do not speak to them or invite them into our houses. We also do not read their books, watch them on television, read what they write on the Internet, or add our own comments about what they write on the Internet.
If I may, I will restate some queries from another poster, all of which you have simply dodged. Given what you say about not reading what they write on the internet and you not adding any comments to what they write on the internet, why are you here posting in this forum? Why are you reading what atheists, non-Christians and non-JWs write? Why are you adding your own comments to what these "false teachers" write? Why are you not yourself avoiding "false teachers"?