How The Game is Played

@averagejoe1 said
A clarification... I simply said that i was agreeing with Trump’s comment. Yes, the words of Trump. I think that I said I can best answer that by repeating trumps comments, which are quite true in my opinion. Settle, Rover. 😕 As far as caring what people say versus what they accomplish, it is not too difficult to be more interested in what Trump accomplished. Ask Handy ...[text shortened]... nal and so personal, when we are looking at an office not a person.
I hate it for y’all........

I don't have a hard time grasping Trump's appeal (although I wouldn't call it a 'concept'😉.

The question is why? We're now 8 pages into a thread you've started in which you claim the Dems and Biden are playing a game with illegal immigrants. And yet there's been no pushback to the fact that all of the actions of the prior administration has had a net negative impact on the number of illegal aliens in the US. Earl has pointed to actions that Trump did: the wall, agreements with Mexico, although I would argue that the results are more important than the actions. Mott provided statistics from Obama showing he did a really good job exporting illegals, but stopped short of providing equivalent comparisons to Trump.

Obviously, I know you like Trump and I get his appeal. But I'm just wondering: why do you keep bringing him up in this context? His legacy so far is terrible on immigration. He defunded e-Verify. The internal deportation rate plummeted. There were numerous surges at the border. I don't get it. Is it just the words or are there any numbers you can point to that represent a significant success of his presidency on immigration?

As far as Biden goes, the jury is still out.

@wildgrass - said
That's a completely false narrative, unless you've changed the definition of "open".
Who's telling you that? We have a regulated border with Mexico.

@1 It's metaphor, WG. relax.

@2 Our border is not the point. It is Mexico's border with Guatemala and Belize that counts.
Why the hell is Guatemala letting these caravans through to Mexico and why is Mexico accepting them?
All this does is jam the US border up, needlessly. Note, the NYT, CNN and all of liberal media
never told us (that I am aware) that the agreement Obrador had with Trump was now demolished, as caravans are pouring in.

@earl-of-trumps said
@wildgrass - said
That's a completely false narrative, unless you've changed the definition of "open".
Who's telling you that? We have a regulated border with Mexico.

@1 It's metaphor, WG. relax.

@2 Our border is not the point. I tis Mexico's border with Guatemala and Belize is what counts.
Why the hell is Guatemala letting these carabans through to M ...[text shortened]... am aware) that the agreement Obrador had with Trump was now demolished, as caravans are pouring in.

Now I'm confused. Open border is a metaphor for what?

You point to the agreements Trump made, but is there any evidence of tangible success of said agreements?

@wildgrass said
Now I'm confused. Open border is a metaphor for what?

You point to the agreements Trump made, but is there any evidence of tangible success of said agreements?

There is a lot of discussion and comparison of who is the worst on the border crisis,,,Trump or Biden/Obama. How bout saying they are both at fault, it is a hard job. Unintended consequence, etc etc.
So where are we now, being flooded at the Border? Next, we discuss whether our leaders want "Open Borders". Kamala will be president inside 2 years.....lets see what she thinks, and discuss from that point on. More interesting, I would think. Trump is gone, and Biden is a suit. Kamala is an open border guy.

https://newsofinterest.tv/globalist_establishment/_biden/harris_wants_open_borders.php

@wildgrass said
I don't have a hard time grasping Trump's appeal (although I wouldn't call it a 'concept'😉.

The question is why? We're now 8 pages into a thread you've started in which you claim the Dems and Biden are playing a game with illegal immigrants. And yet there's been no pushback to the fact that all of the actions of the prior administration has had a net negative impact on t ...[text shortened]... ignificant success of his presidency on immigration?

As far as Biden goes, the jury is still out.

Contrare', the jury has rendered a verdict on Biden and gone home. Comments on Trump are a bit irrelevant, the world is moving REALLY fast. Obama was building the Wall in 2008. Do you want to argue about THAT?!? Anyway, Gird your loins.

@averagejoe1 said
There is a lot of discussion and comparison of who is the worst on the border crisis,,,Trump or Biden/Obama. How bout saying they are both at fault, it is a hard job. Unintended consequence, etc etc.
So where are we now, being flooded at the Border? Next, we discuss whether our leaders want "Open Borders". Kamala will be president inside 2 years.....lets see what ...[text shortened]... order guy.

https://newsofinterest.tv/globalist_establishment/_biden/harris_wants_open_borders.php

How bout saying they are both at fault, it is a hard job. Unintended consequence, etc etc.

I think we could have had a productive discussion about what the best immigration policies might be going forward, if you didn't keep bring up 'Trump was better' without justification in the conversation.

There's no evidence I'm aware of that the wall has worked as a deterrent. Do you have that data?

There is evidence that interior deportations of illegal immigrants plummeted under Trump, and this has led to a leveling off of the illegal population that was decreasing under Obama. If that is a unintended consequence of something Trump did, then it's something we should learn our lesson from and not repeat. Right?

@wildgrass said

How bout saying they are both at fault, it is a hard job. Unintended consequence, etc etc.

I think we could have had a productive discussion about what the best immigration policies might be going forward, if you didn't keep bring up 'Trump was better' without justification in the conversation.

There's no evidence I'm aware of that the wall has worked as ...[text shortened]... e of something Trump did, then it's something we should learn our lesson from and not repeat. Right?

Y0u are correct! Biden is doing a better job at the border, is that what you are saying???
How bout you do a bit of your own citing, although the news already is telling me plenty.....about Biden's handling, his policies.
Wildgrass, today (April 28) has nothing to do with Trump. I am the main person on this Forum who wishes the name Trump would be banned!!!! You've seen how I have derided the Posts of Sonhouse!!! I am looking at Biden, the children, the rapes, Biden T-shirts saying come on in. Do you think his time might be better spent getting ready for the crush of China, instead of coddling illegal immigrants? A fair question.

Here is Kamala on the border, in case you missed it.

https://newsofinterest.tv/globalist_establishment/_biden/harris_wants_open_borders.php

@wildgrass said
Now I'm confused. Open border is a metaphor for what?

You point to the agreements Trump made, but is there any evidence of tangible success of said agreements?

metaphor in the sense that - it might as well be an open border. Many are getting through illegally.

Trump-Mexico Immigration Deal Breaks Up Caravan of 2000 Migrants

New immigration procedures implemented by Mexican President Andrés Manuel López Obrador (AMLO) effectively disbanded a group of 2,000 mostly Central American caravan migrants.

Immigration policies put in place following an agreement between Mexico and the Trump Administration broke up a caravan consisting of approximately 2,000 people from Central America, Africa, and the Caribbean Islands, the Associated Press reported Saturday. The group began to move northward from Tapachula, Chiapas, early one morning last week after being held up for official travel documents. The group quickly encountered Mexican Federal Police and members of the newly formed National Guard.
-------------------------------------------------------
https://www.breitbart.com/border/2019/10/14/trump-mexico-immigration-deal-breaks-up-caravan-of-2000-migrants/

There are other links if you dislike Breitbart.

@wildgrass said

How bout saying they are both at fault, it is a hard job. Unintended consequence, etc etc.

I think we could have had a productive discussion about what the best immigration policies might be going forward, if you didn't keep bring up 'Trump was better' without justification in the conversation.

There's no evidence I'm aware of that the wall has worked as ...[text shortened]... e of something Trump did, then it's something we should learn our lesson from and not repeat. Right?

Awww, old boring history again. Right now is the issue.

"Was ;the wall a deterrent" Maybe yes, maybe no. So what. "Deportations under Trump' so what. Jesus. Have you seen what happened there yesterday? Kids walking around in the bushes, one says " I want to go to N Carolina". Catch up , man
And a bit late to talk to Obama and Rice (the real Presidents) about learning a lesson. It is a going concern, and google can answer any of their questions. Hey, I have an idea...1M people come in a year!!!! Pure genius. They will all vote Democrat, so everyone should be happy.

@AverageJoe1 - said
"Was ;the wall a deterrent" Maybe yes, maybe no. So what.

If the wall was no deterrent whatsoever, liberals would be laughing and cheering.

@Earl-of-Trumps
You BOTH are as full of shyte as a christmas turkey. EVERYONE but Trump KNEW a wall was useless and a waste of money.

You can cut one of the posts down with a battery powered sawzall.

Yep, REAL protection from those myriad marauders flowing over the border by the tens of thousands every hour.

Yep, we need to activate the National Guard and KILL every one of those rapists and murderers and MASSIVE drug dealers anywhere we find them.

Yep, if they are trying to float the river, they are SO much easier to kill when they are in the water.

Yes, we need a 500 FOOT high solid rock barrier between San Diego and FLORIDA to keep out that sub human scum coming across in the millions.

And OF COURSE Mexico will pay for it......

@sonhouse said
@Earl-of-Trumps
You BOTH are as full of shyte as a christmas turkey. EVERYONE but Trump KNEW a wall was useless and a waste of money.

You can cut one of the posts down with a battery powered sawzall.

Yep, REAL protection from those myriad marauders flowing over the border by the tens of thousands every hour.

Yep, we need to activate the National Guard and KILL eve ...[text shortened]... ut that sub human scum coming across in the millions.

And OF COURSE Mexico will pay for it......

......help...........................................................

@averagejoe1 said
Y0u are correct! Biden is doing a better job at the border, is that what you are saying???
How bout you do a bit of your own citing, although the news already is telling me plenty.....about Biden's handling, his policies.
Wildgrass, today (April 28) has nothing to do with Trump. I am the main person on this Forum who wishes the name Trump would be banned!! ...[text shortened]... missed it.

https://newsofinterest.tv/globalist_establishment/_biden/harris_wants_open_borders.php

How bout you do a bit of your own citing

It's waaay too early to compare the relative successes of Biden vs the prior administration. There's literally no data. But I think it's you that said Obama is the puppet master. Luckily we do have plenty of data there. Can we do a Trump v. Obama for a tight minute?

The immigration policy that Trump implemented did not reduce illegal immigration [1].

The Trump administration cut funding for e-Verify to salvage the farm vote.

From 2017-2020 there was a sharp and impactful collapse of interior immigration enforcement. "...the Trump administration only managed to remove 325,660 people from the interior of the United States during the entire term in office." [2] Compare that to more than 1.2 million under Obama's tenure. As a result of this failure, the population of illegal immigrants that went down under Obama remained about the same as when Trump took office [1].

As long as the demand for cheap labor exists, illegal immigration will not stop. Trump did nothing at all to stem the tide. Therefore, he is a big open borders guy. Is that how we're defining open borders? If anyone gets in it's open?

[1] https://www.cato.org/blog/president-trump-reduced-legal-immigration-he-did-not-reduce-illegal-immigration

[2] https://www.cato.org/blog/interior-immigration-enforcement-has-collapsed-under-trump-lowest-level-george-w-bush

@earl-of-trumps said
metaphor in the sense that - it might as well be an open border. Many are getting through illegally.

Trump-Mexico Immigration Deal Breaks Up Caravan of 2000 Migrants

New immigration procedures implemented by Mexican President Andrés Manuel López Obrador (AMLO) effectively disbanded a group of 2,000 mostly Central American caravan migrants.[i]

Immigratio ...[text shortened]... igration-deal-breaks-up-caravan-of-2000-migrants/

There are other links if you dislike Breitbart.

The term 'open border' has a definition - it's not a metaphor for anything. Of course people still get across, we have international air travel and what not.

I don't disparage breitbart but I also don't understand your point in posting this article.

@sonhouse said
@Earl-of-Trumps
You BOTH are as full of shyte as a christmas turkey. EVERYONE but Trump KNEW a wall was useless and a waste of money.

You can cut one of the posts down with a battery powered sawzall.

Yep, REAL protection from those myriad marauders flowing over the border by the tens of thousands every hour.

Yep, we need to activate the National Guard and KILL eve ...[text shortened]... ut that sub human scum coming across in the millions.

And OF COURSE Mexico will pay for it......

In other words, stop building the wall! Don't try to fortify it, noooooooooooooo. Abandom it.

Liberal propaganda. 😆

If people are trying to break into your home, don't do anything to stop it, just let them in. Uh huh