What does "everybody is evil" mean?

Originally posted by sonhouse
What is hard for me to understand is why people continue to believe in the bible god, thinking it comes to them in times of need and so forth, when in the 20th century wars 100 MILLION died at the hands of despots, many tortured, raped, children killed, gold pulled out of dead people's mouths and not a word from this so-called gracious god. It is clear it w ...[text shortened]... d doing absolutely nothing in spite of the fact millions of those killed were in fact Christian.

Well there is evil in the world and we are the ones doing it more times than not.
God tells us to be kind to one another, to love one another, and what do we do, see your
post.

Bad people doesn't mean there isn't a good God, and I'd say God has and does respond
too.

Originally posted by Zahlanzi
"God does not do anything for "no reason", we may not grasp it, "
this is kind of a discussion ender.
"why? because god has a reason. which is? dunno, but must be a good one"

if someone starts printing bibles saying that all who wear pink must be killed in the name of god, would you not question it? would you not look for a reason?

"and this life ...[text shortened]... l, and we do because we are christians, it is proof that the murderer god of the OT is not real.

""why? because god has a reason. which is? dunno, but must be a good one""

You are kidding right? I don't know why you do and say the things you do, how would I
know the ends and outs of God?

"if someone starts printing bibles saying that all who wear pink must be killed in the name of god, would you not question it? would you not look for a reason? "

I'd look for scripture that stood the test of time not this joke of an example you just
produced.

My wife and I lost our first child 13 days past her first birthday, yes things like that are
very tragic I would not wish that on anyone. Is that the end of her life, I don't believe so
and I have hope we will see each other again.

Originally posted by FMF
You contend that the contradictions can always be explained so that they are then no longer contradictory, right? Presumably you subscribe to the explanations that you favour and therefore see no contradictions.

Let's go through your list [b]with changes as I see fit according to what I see as your stance:

checkbaiter says: Apparent contradictions ...[text shortened]...

All you are doing, as I see it, is laying out every self-anointed cherry picker's manifesto.

You assume too much. It is not as I see it.
It is as every good bible teacher teaches.
You as usual, are trying to belittle bible study as done by well known bible teachers.
I never said "as I see it", this is your MOS, twist words a little here and there and try to belittle the other person, while you appear to be "superior" in your dialogue.
Do you think I am the originator of bible study? Research?
What I posted has been the method of sound bible study by great teachers, who were here long before you and me.
So your smug little plan fails again.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
You assume too much. It is not as I see it.
It is as every good bible teacher teaches.
You as usual, are trying to belittle bible study as done by well known bible teachers.
I never said "as I see it", this is your MOS, twist words a little here and there and try to belittle the other person, while you appear to be "superior" in your dialogue.
Do yo ...[text shortened]... by great teachers, who were here long before you and me.
So your smug little plan fails again.

None of this explains ~ or wishes out of existence ~ the inconsistencies and contradictions of the Bible.

Originally posted by KellyJay
God is not opposing himself, Pharaoh gets upset that he is losing and attacks. Again, God
has made it very clear, instead turning towards God he does his best to destroy what God
is doing. God is not schizophrenic, if those that reject God truly want to reject God they will
do so with everything they have. The only thing here that should be lesson is tha ...[text shortened]... ice is ours. If we fight against God we will lose, that part should be
very clear, ask Pharaoh.

Kelly, you are completely missing the point. This has nothing to do with opposing God, or lessons learned.
Yes, at first Pharaoh opposed God. But when he was overwhelmed by plagues, he decided to let the people go. THEN, the bible says God hardened Pharaohs heart. This is saying Pharaoh was refused free will because then God hardened Pharaoh's heart.
I don't know how to make this any clearer.

Originally posted by FMF
None of this explains ~ or wishes out of existence ~ the inconsistencies and contradictions of the Bible.

In your eyes.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
In your eyes.

Nope. In what you said. Which was "What I posted has been the method of sound bible study by great teachers, who were here long before you and me." And of course "great teachers" have been divided by the inconsistencies and contradictions of the Bible for hundreds and hundreds of years, and there have been countless hundreds - maybe thousands - of denominations, sects and cults - all with their "great teachers" - and countless people killed violently directly and indirectly because of the inconsistencies and contradictions of the Bible.

And there's you telling us that the contradictions are only "Apparent contradictions" and you have your little six point formula which apparently makes the contradictions go away. And you have the gall to say it's ME who is "smug"? 😉

Originally posted by checkbaiter
Kelly, you are completely missing the point. This has nothing to do with opposing God, or lessons learned.
Yes, at first Pharaoh opposed God. But when he was overwhelmed by plagues, he decided to let the people go. [b]THEN, the bible says God hardened Pharaohs heart. This is saying Pharaoh was refused free will because then God hardened Pharaoh's heart.
I don't know how to make this any clearer.[/b]

I've repeatedly said, YES GOD DID THAT! He did it the same way He draws us to Him,
He reveals Himself, He shows us who He is, and we react one of two ways. God does not
temp us with evil, we are tempted by the lust in our own hearts. God does not force
anyone to do evil, but we do. We are shown His loving kindness we either turn towards
Him or we do not. We will react and if we react against God our hearts get hard, so God
by doing the same thing towards those that choose to follow Him also hardens the hearts
of those that reject Him at some point they are lost forever.

Originally posted by FMF
Nope. In what you said. Which was "What I posted has been the method of sound bible study by great teachers, who were here long before you and me." And of course "great teachers" have been divided by the inconsistencies and contradictions of the Bible for hundreds and hundreds of years, and there have been countless hundreds - maybe thousands - of denominations, ...[text shortened]... arently makes the contradictions go away. And you have the gall to say it's ME who is "smug"? 😉

Again, they are not "my" 6 point formula as you describe it. Not all bible teachers use it, to their detriment.
There are faithful people who spend their life times researching these points. They are rewarded with truth.
Someone once said that the closer you look at a man made object, the more flaws we will find. And the closer we look at Creation, the more perfection we find.
The word of God is like that. The closer we look the more perfect it becomes.
Imagine for a moment 66 books, all from different time periods, many different writers with very different vocabularies.
That is a wonder in itself, the way the 66 books complement and build on each other because the writers, were "moved" by the Holy Spirit, which is God.
So in essence, the author is God Himself.
Yes, there are many denominations, cults, inconsistencies, for many different reasons.
But I submit it is possible to get back to the original word of God as spoken by holy men as they were moved by God.
It takes diligent study, commitment, faithfulness and love for God.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
Again, they are not "my" 6 point formula as you describe it. Not all bible teachers use it, to their detriment.
There are faithful people who spend their life times researching these points. They are rewarded with truth.
Someone once said that the closer you look at a man made object, the more flaws we will find. And the closer we look at Creation, t ...[text shortened]... as they were moved by God.
It takes diligent study, commitment, faithfulness and love for God.

None of this [even with all the ad hominem nonsense of your previous post now removed]... none of it explains ~ or removes ~ the inconsistencies and contradictions of the Bible.

Originally posted by KellyJay
""why? because god has a reason. which is? dunno, but must be a good one""

You are kidding right? I don't know why you do and say the things you do, how would I
know the ends and outs of God?

"if someone starts printing bibles saying that all who wear pink must be killed in the name of god, would you not question it? would you not look for a reason? ...[text shortened]... . Is that the end of her life, I don't believe so
and I have hope we will see each other again.

"You are kidding right? I don't know why you do and say the things you do, how would I
know the ends and outs of God?"
when would you ask? you don't wonder what exactly was the reason behind killing everyone in the world, so that's already worrying. so what does it take to question god's reasons? if god asks you to murder children, would that be a good time to maybe question the motive and, i don't know, NOT do it?


"I'd look for scripture that stood the test of time not this joke of an example you just
produced."
this example i gave assumes the text is just as old as the gospel of luke. it was just discovered. it is proven to be authentic. it says you must kill people who dress in pink. do you do it?

Originally posted by KellyJay
I've repeatedly said, YES GOD DID THAT! He did it the same way He draws us to Him,
He reveals Himself, He shows us who He is, and we react one of two ways. God does not
temp us with evil, we are tempted by the lust in our own hearts. God does not force
anyone to do evil, but we do. We are shown His loving kindness we either turn towards
Him or we do not ...[text shortened]... ollow Him also hardens the hearts
of those that reject Him at some point they are lost forever.

Why would God have to "harden the hearts" of those who reject him?
They are already lost. It doesn't make sense. They harden their own heart.
Look, my point in all of this is Satan hardened Pharaoh's heart not God. It is the figure of speech "Metonomy".
There is good reason for God to use this figure. Believers in the Old Testament did not have "Christ in them" like today. They did not understand spiritual matters like today.
Only a few of them had holy spirit and it was conditional on their behavior.
That is why David in the Psalms begged God, " do not take take your holy spirit from me".
Believers in the old testament were under a different covenant. They could not cast out demons, or have any kind of authority like today.
Jesus Christ changed all that. His atoning sacrifice had dire ramifications for Satan and demonic presence.
That is why the bible declares that if the god of this world had known what would happen, he would not have crucified the Lord of Glory.
Many Christians today are living with an old covenant mentality. They are weak, beaten up by the devil, sick, have poverty, and so on.
This is why I get frustrated here. I'm not mad at anyone, I just hate the devil and what he does to people, lies about God's goodness, lies about God's word.
The church is not only under attack by unbelievers, but by uninformed Christians too.
There are many Christians taught today that God makes them sick to "teach" them.
They teach you can lose your salvation, they teach eternal hell fire, and many other ungodly things.
Jesus came not just to save us from our sins, but to live a victorious life, an abundant life, confident and at peace with God. As fellow workers with him, growing unto a holy temple to the Lord. Filled with joy, helping people and freeing them from the grasp of Satan.
God is good, God is love, and He wants us to be good Ambassadors.

Originally posted by FMF
None of this [even with all the ad hominem nonsense of your previous post now removed]... none of it explains ~ or removes ~ the inconsistencies and contradictions of the Bible.

We are at an impasse since you clearly reject figures of speech in the bible. No need to continue here.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
We are at an impasse since you clearly reject figures of speech in the bible. No need to continue here.

The only thing that I reject is your assertion that the inconsistencies and contradictions in the Bible are only "apparent" as opposed to 'actual'.

Originally posted by FMF
The only thing that I reject is your assertion that the inconsistencies and contradictions in the Bible are only "apparent" as opposed to 'actual'.

Noted 😴