What do you have to loose?

@fmf said
You asked me this question - in essence - in 2016, 2017 and 2018, repeatedly, and at first, I answered it a few times ~ and even divulged quite personal information in doing so ~ but you ignored the answers, and just repeated the question, and my answers got shorter, and in the end, I stopped answering and told you, instead, that my answer had not changed since when we'd talked about it before. This is my response to you now, as well.

Actually if I recall correctly the first time I asked you this question you claimed that if I went back and read the tens of thousands of posts you have posted before I might find an answer to my question there. It seems you are playing the same evasion games now that you did then. Oh well I guess that does answer my question unequivocally.

@dj2becker said
Actually if I recall correctly the first time I asked you this question you claimed that if I went back and read the tens of thousands of posts you have posted before I might find an answer to my question there. It seems you are playing the same evasion games now that you did then. Oh well I guess that does answer my question unequivocally.

Call it how you see it.

@fmf said
Call it how you see it.

Classic. Pure gold.

@sonship said
If you don't mind at all repeating essentially this concept many times since 2016, why does it irk you to have to repeat anything else?

I post as I see fit. I reveal what I want to. I repeat myself whenever I choose to. I refer people back to previous discussions when that seems appropriate. Isn't that how it works for us all on a message board like this? Don't you do the same thing?

@sonship said
And those Christians from your past that you said you quite admired, have you told them also that their "god figure" is entirely fallacious and imaginary?

I am not in touch with all the Christians I've admired over the last 40 years.

Aside from them, the Christians that I live and work among nowadays - including those I admire - know that I have lost my faith and, in some cases, this fact, and the process that led to it, have been pored over in detail and at length.

Those Christians also know that I believe faith in God gives billions of people meaning and purpose in life; it gives them structure; it gives them pointers for their moral compasses; it more often than not gives them a sense of community and belonging.

Indeed, I benefit in many ways from all those effects that faith has upon people I know.

When I interact with Christians - or people of other faiths - in some arena or venue or context that is the equivalent of this forum in terms of purpose and opportunity, I speak about my beliefs in the same way as I speak about them here.

I have never once said to you that your God figure is "entirely fallacious", so that is not language that I use with people I meet.

Nor do I describe anyone's beliefs as "animal excrement" or "germs" or "disease" being spread by "unclean dogs" or "pigs".

Perhaps that's the kind of language you would use if you visited Indonesia and got talking to people with different beliefs from you.

I never pretend or claim that my beliefs with regard to religion and supernatural matters are anything other than my personal, subjective perspectives about the reality in which we live.

The notion that other people's objects of faith are "imaginary" is not particularly controversial here when you bear in mind that this society is stitched together with a range of mutually 'contradictory' religious traditions.

I like listening to JD Farag a middle eastern man that is a Christian that is a Pastor in Hawaii. He does weekly Bible Prophecy updates. This is the best presentation on how to become saved.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GEk8C6qe960&feature=emb_title

@bigdoggproblem said
There are also verses like "deny yourself, take up your cross, and follow me" which make following sound difficult. How to reconcile the passages? Maybe get help from context? But certainly not make a blanket conclusion based on either one alone.

Sorry for not replying, lost track of this thread.

Good question I think; for me the understanding is in the dynamic between that which we are required to do as obedience, and that which God does in us.

To explain; “take up your cross” “follow me” “deny (him)self” are all acts of the flesh, whereby we are told to physically (including mental effort) do something. There is no righteousness is these actions, they are simply a person hearing their masters voice. These things are indeed difficult they require effort but they are not “being a Christian.” They are works, effort, sleeves up, graft of obedience through faith.

However the “My burden is light” which Jesus says refers to Christ taking the burden of us not having to necessarily be good at this stuff, or of failing because the victory is a spiritual one and the effort to provide righteousness is his alone. It’s the core of the faith vs works argument.

I accept your point.

halfway between he walks
the world in shadow business
he shops to help the economy
personalities trouble his sleep

sometimes he would mention
usually inappropriately
sometimes he would mention
"my burden is light"

riding home at night
the colors and leaf shadows
the village lights at evening
the moon above the clouds

@caesar-salad said
halfway between he walks
the world in shadow business
he shops to help the economy
personalities trouble his sleep

sometimes he would mention
usually inappropriately
sometimes he would mention
"my burden is light"

riding home at night
the colors and leaf shadows
the village lights at evening
the moon above the clouds

That is beautiful; what’s it about?