To all the creationists denying evolution ....

Originally posted by FabianFnas
You are very unclear. You did read my posting, did you?

I still think it's a stupid to think that christians cannot take string theory as true because it's not in the bible. Is it this you object to?

The bible says nothing about evolution, therefore christians, true christians cannot believe in evolution? How could they, when they didn't have the kn ...[text shortened]... ists) that evolution is wrong?

Why is evolution so hard for fundamentalists to understand?

the point is, that evolution is not a part of Gods creation, nor can it be inferred from scripture that this is the case, in fact quite the contrary. its simply not a case of whether evolution is true, or whether the bible is true, that is not the issue, it is whether they are mutually compatible, and as yet I see no evidence, no, not the slimmest, meanest, flimsiest pretentious pretext for accepting that they are!

Originally posted by black beetle
This is as accurate as yer 12.Ke2 ye leggedy beastie😵

the game was lost from the beginning, why i digressed from my beloved 1.e4 i do not know, but all is not lost, he may crash through on my kingside but he will feel the wrath of my centralized knight soon! never the less i count it as a learning experience!

Originally posted by LemonJello
[b]what i am saying for the third time is that a contradiction exists between the teaching of Christ and his endorsement of creation and the idea of the evolutionary hypothesis as a plausible account of the diversity of life!

Then you are simply begging the question and you have not presented any argument worth taking seriously. If you haven't fig ou are quite simply just begging the question. How can you not see this as question-begging?[/b]

whether you take it seriously is neither here nor there, a reference was given, various attempts have been made to discredit the reference, for example,

1. that it is open to interpretation, false! there is nothing to interpret,
2. that it was taken out of context, false! for it is in complete harmony with the bible as a whole
3. that there was nothing known about evolution, irrelevant! for we know what scripture states and can compare the two
4. that many 'Christians', accept evolution, irrelevant! for this has nothing to do with what Christ nor the Bible teaches

what question begging is i have no idea, what i can state with crystal clear certainty is, that if you give credence to what Christ states, that we are here as a direct consequence of a creative act there is no room for the evolutionary hypothesis, refute it if you will, with reference if you please!

please note this is not a discussion about the merits of evolutionary hypothesis nor of creation, its a discussion of whether the two are compatible!

Originally posted by Zahlanzi
yes, it does say something. but it is taken out of context. the meaning is missed entirely just to express his point.

jesus was giving marriage advice. and he used the sole argument those pharisees could accept. this is what we know for sure. how would it have sounded like "two people shouldn't divorce because man evolved from ape". it doesn't make sense ...[text shortened]... ic reason and anyone who does it is stupid, ignorant or insane to quote the mighty dawkins.

obviously we are too stupid to reply to this profound reasoning, i think its therefore better to desist, yet you persist in your contradiction and until you are able to come to terms with the fact that the two are incongruous, you will continue to persist!

Originally posted by twhitehead
For once I will support Robbie. He insists that the Bible does say something about evolution. It provides a clearly incompatible alternative. You may disagree with that claim, but you must show it. Simply repeating that the Bible does not say anything about evolution does not help.

thankyou twithead, it is amazing that the issue has been so thoroughly misunderstood and muddy in the eyes of some! i don't know why, for if i was a christian and an evolutionist i would have a dilemma on my hands which i would need to resolve.

the main attempts seem to be to try to distance the two, that they have nothing in common and should not be considered in the same light, but this is unsatisfactory, for it fails to take into account what Christ and the scriptures are actually saying. and secondly that the two are harmonious, but as yet, no evidence has been produced, i don't know why? perhaps because none exists?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
obviously we are too stupid to reply to this profound reasoning, i think its therefore better to desist, yet you persist in your contradiction and until you are able to come to terms with the fact that the two are incongruous, you will continue to persist!

if we are to stupid to think for ourselves, are we not too stupid to understand what jesus meant when he said those words to the pharisees?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
what question begging is i have no idea, what i can state with crystal clear certainty is, that if you give credence to what Christ states, that we are here as a direct consequence of a creative act there is no room for the evolutionary hypothesis, refute it if you will, with reference if you please!

Many Christians (I think the pope included) believe that Gods 'creative act' could in part be evolution. They argue that God created the universe and man but that the description of said creation in Genesis is not meant to be a literal description of each step or technique used. Once could argue that for God to arrange to have an advanced physics book written and distributed in ancient times would be rather unusual to say the least and that such an act did not suit his purposes.
I for one do not think the writer of Genesis expected anyone to take it word for word as fact, but had a much more important intention.

The post that was quoted here has been removed

the Christ states that the universe has arisen as a divine act of creation, did he not? you are saying that it evolved, are you not? why can you not see a contradiction? the act of creation leaves no room for the evolutionary process. for example evolution states that there was a transmigration of one species into another, thus fish became amphibians, amphibians became reptiles, reptiles became birds, birds became mammals. mammals became humans etc etc the Genesis account simply states that God created these things according to their kinds, this is a complete and utter contradiction. but it is not up to me this time, for i have provided a reference, its up to you guys to prove why i should accept that they are compatible.

Originally posted by twhitehead
Many Christians (I think the pope included) believe that Gods 'creative act' could in part be evolution. They argue that God created the universe and man but that the description of said creation in Genesis is not meant to be a literal description of each step or technique used. Once could argue that for God to arrange to have an advanced physics book wri ...[text shortened]... sis expected anyone to take it word for word as fact, but had a much more important intention.

yes but this is of its very nature speculative and contradicts what the Christ was saying. i understand the argument, but as yet see no evidence for accepting it, indeed to do so, i would need to disbelieve what the Christ taught, would i not?

Originally posted by Zahlanzi
if we are to stupid to think for ourselves, are we not too stupid to understand what jesus meant when he said those words to the pharisees?

its not only Christs words, there are many other references to the creation of the universe as being a divine act and not one of them can be interpreted to incorporate the evolutionary hypothesis, so why should i accept it?

The post that was quoted here has been removed

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are you so daft as to think adam and eve got busy as bunnies, and then their children made incestous retard babbies who made retard incestous babbies of their own?
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Are you so daft that you believe that apes got busy like bunnies having children and one day they had a human?

If a frog turns into a prince it is called a fairy tale.

If a frog turns into a prince over 10 million years its called science.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
yes but this is of its very nature speculative and contradicts what the Christ was saying. i understand the argument, but as yet see no evidence for accepting it, indeed to do so, i would need to disbelieve what the Christ taught, would i not?

I disagree. I don't see how Christs words as quoted by you can be said to contradict Evolution. All Christ says is that God created Man and Woman. He doesn't specify how. I think it is you that is reading far more into the words than is actually there.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
its not only Christs words, there are many other references to the creation of the universe as being a divine act and not one of them can be interpreted to incorporate the evolutionary hypothesis, so why should i accept it?

Why cant they be interpreted as incorporating the evolutionary hypothesis? Which hypothesis should they incorporate and why? Surely a 'divine act' works by some method and that method operated via some set of rules and those rules are by definition laws of physics.
I find too many people trying to pretend that if an act is divine then it not only violates the laws of physics but is also unknowable in nature. "God works in mysterious ways". But there is no justification for such a belief.