Originally posted by KellyJay
Jesus is the template for Christians, He is the Christ, where do you think the name
[b]Christian came from?[/b]

Jesus is the template from some Christians, who believe in following Jesus
The other Christians preach mouth worship, and believe in talking.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
Will Jews, who doesn't accept Jesus Christ as their savior, end up in hell, burning for eternity?

If I don't accept Jesus Christ as my savior, will also I end up in hell, burning for eternity?

No human being will end up in hell burning for eternity.

Many Christians are going to be disappointed with this outcome; sonship for example, relies on the consequence of hell as a catalyst for he,ping him forgive those who abuse him. KellyJay on the other hand just accepts hell as truth because, as he says, it's there in the Bible.

Originally posted by KellyJay
Jesus said

John 3: 16-18 ESV
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him
should not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to
condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. Whoever
believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is ...[text shortened]... back to God, from there we are to live as one who is in His
Kingdom, loving God and each other.

Nice dodge!

Originally posted by KellyJay
Jesus is the template for Christians, He is the Christ, where do you think the name
[b]Christian came from?[/b]

So the Jews then...hell is it?

Originally posted by whodey
,Seriously though, I find it pointless to ask this question, especially since I don't have the list and don't make the list, nor does anyone else here.

What I do believe, however, is that Jesus is the only way to God, which is how Jews like Abraham and David eventually were able to go to heaven.

From the Jew point of view, they will go to heaven, and noone else.
From the Moslem point of view, they will go to heaven, and noone else.
And from the Christian point of view, they will go to heaven, and noone else.
All branches have their own heaven and hell.

There is an important point in this matter - and that is: Is the jewish people closer to god than christians? After all, they are the gods own people, are they not? Meaning that they can reach heaven without Jesus, right?

So the question is a serious one, and I am very interested to know what a real christian believes.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
From the Jew point of view, they will go to heaven, and noone else.
From the Moslem point of view, they will go to heaven, and noone else.
And from the Christian point of view, they will go to heaven, and noone else.
All branches have their own heaven and hell.

There is an important point in this matter - and that is: Is the jewish people closer to ...[text shortened]... the question is a serious one, and I am very interested to know what a real christian believes.

Ask yourself this, every person on the planet has a point of view, they can agree with
some and disagree with others. Does it matter what anyone's point of views are, if God
has one on any topic? Even if the vast majority agree on some topic, like God will not
send anyone to a devil's hell, if God has said that was going to happen, will a poll among
humans change anything? Would it matter if 7 out of 10 people didn't think God would or
should do that, if God said He was going to?

Originally posted by Rajk999
God likes good an righteous people. These will end up in the Kingdom of God

What one professes with their mouth means nothing. What one believes in their heart means something. It is through belief in your heart that good works are done.

Therefore a man can say he believes but does nothing. Another man can say he does not believe but does something.

Mouth worship and those who practice it are despicable to God.

Rajk, this posting of yours I like very much! And I agree in the spirit very much. You get a thumb up for this one!

There are people who thinks that it's enough to confess to the christian faith, and then he will have heaven for free, regardless of his deeds or absence of them.

And I think that an atheist with a good hart and good deeds will enter the pearly gates.

...well, besides my beliefs that heaven and hell does not exist.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
Rajk, this posting of yours I like very much! And I agree in the spirit very much. You get a thumb up for this one!

There are people who thinks that it's enough to confess to the christian faith, and then he will have heaven for free, regardless of his deeds or absence of them.

And I think that an atheist with a good hart and good deeds will enter the pearly gates.

...well, besides my beliefs that heaven and hell does not exist.

I agree with him on that point too, there are those that do that. It does not at all alter the
fact that that Jesus died so we could be saved. Sinners who love their sin are going to
get what their sins call for, sinners who go to God for His grace and mercy through the One
God sent to save us, will be saved.

Originally posted by KellyJay
Ask yourself this, every person on the planet has a point of view, they can agree with
some and disagree with others. Does it matter what anyone's point of views are, if God
has one on any topic? Even if the vast majority agree on some topic, like God will not
send anyone to a devil's hell, if God has said that was going to happen, will a poll among
hum ...[text shortened]... er if 7 out of 10 people didn't think God would or
should do that, if God said He was going to?

Okay, I asked myself, and came up with this thoughts:

I think that the christian community is not homogenous. There are as many sets of beliefs that there are christians. No christian can be a spokesperson for all christians. Every experience of god is a personal one. No churches with rules what is right and wrong are meaningful.

So what is right and what is wrong? Right is always the path of love, never the path of hate. By hating them who believe differently is to hate people in general, because there is noone that believes exactly like oneself. There are muslims with loving harts, and there are christian with hating harts. Who will enter to pearly gate, do you think? I think I know the answer. Do you?

Originally posted by KellyJay
I agree with him on that point too, there are those that do that. It does not at all alter the
fact that that Jesus died so we could be saved. Sinners who love their sin are going to
get what their sins call for, sinners who go to God for His grace and mercy through the One
God sent to save us, will be saved.

I don't live my life to end up in heaven. I live my life to be a good person. After my death god or gods will decide. Or I will just end my life, happy.

Originally posted by divegeester
So the Jews then...hell is it?

You will NEVER get a straight answer out of KJ.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
Will Jews, who doesn't accept Jesus Christ as their savior, end up in hell, burning for eternity?

If I don't accept Jesus Christ as my savior, will also I end up in hell, burning for eternity?

Why single out the Jews? Everyone who does not accept Jesus, repent from their sins and follow His teachings will be 'lost'. What that 'lost' means is open to interpretation but it surely means separated from God for all eternity as far as I understand.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
Okay, I asked myself, and came up with this thoughts:

I think that the christian community is not homogenous. There are as many sets of beliefs that there are christians. No christian can be a spokesperson for all christians. Every experience of god is a personal one. No churches with rules what is right and wrong are meaningful.

So what is right an ...[text shortened]... th hating harts. Who will enter to pearly gate, do you think? I think I know the answer. Do you?

There is only One Lord, and One Spirit of God, we divide ourselves over some really
stupid reasons. I recall a story that was covered in a news paper talking about two failing
churches that were going to merge. They had everything ironed out except one, one
group wanted the Lord's prayer to be "And forgive us our sins", while the other group
wanted the say, "And forgive our debts", and because of that they didn't merge, the news
paper following the story said, one group went back to their sins, while the other their
debts.

What we are talking about in a sinful people, that God is reaching out too. He has to come
into our lives to make us new creatures in Christ. Not everyone who claims to be a
Christian has done that, and some here even frown upon that I guess, since they are
always talking against it. The bottom line get your eyes off people, we suck, where the
reality is, is God. I cannot prove He is real, I cannot show you God is real, but He can.

God is love, He loves us and will not force you to do anything, the choice is always yours.
God is also Just, He will do everything justly, and righteously. He did not just forgive us
for our sins, He paid a price for them so we could be saved righteously, Jesus who was
sinless, became sin for us, so us sinners can be saved.

If you listen to some here, you'd think that isn't true, they are pushing being good enough,
and none of us are good enough. If we do good works, we are only doing what we are
supposed to be doing nothing more, and that alone does not clean us from our guilt of sin.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
I don't live my life to end up in heaven. I live my life to be a good person. After my death god or gods will decide. Or I will just end my life, happy.

If you die in your sins, you will not be happy. How good, is good enough to be accepted by
God? You need to connect to your creator, you were formed in your mother's womb by Him,
and He good things He wants to do to you, and through you.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
From the Jew point of view, they will go to heaven, and noone else.
From the Moslem point of view, they will go to heaven, and noone else.
And from the Christian point of view, they will go to heaven, and noone else.
All branches have their own heaven and hell.

There is an important point in this matter - and that is: Is the jewish people closer to ...[text shortened]... the question is a serious one, and I am very interested to know what a real christian believes.

Here is an answer and I will use the favourite passage Christians like to quote to show that only Christians will get into Gods Kingdom.

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son,
that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world;
but that the world through him might be saved.
He that believeth on him is not condemned:
but he that believeth not is condemned already,
because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world,
and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
For every one that doeth evil hateth the light,
neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
But he that doeth truth cometh to the light,
that his deeds may be made manifest,
that they are wrought in God.
(John 3:16-21 KJV)

Only Christians proclaim their faith in Christ with their mouth, and Christians use this passage to show that they alone will get eternal life. They are mistaken. This passage talks about believing with the heart which leads to righteousness and good works. Jesus also says this:

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord,
shall enter into the kingdom of heaven;
but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Many will say to me in that day,
Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name?
and in thy name have cast out devils?
and in thy name done many wonderful works?
And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you:
depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them,
I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
And the rain descended, and the floods came,
and the winds blew, and beat upon that house;
and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.
And every one that heareth these sayings of mine,
and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man,
which built his house upon the sand:
And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew,
and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.
(Matthew 7:21-27 KJV)

Jesus is saying that professing to believe and saying 'Lord, Lord' will not fool Him.
Jesus condemns all those like these people who profess their faith and do no good works but are workers of iniquity
The wise man follows His commandments
the foolish man does not.
The wise man is on solid ground
The foolish man will be blown away by anything evil that comes his way because he does not follow the commandments of Christ
Those who dont follow Christ will be destroyed

From those two passages from Christ here are some reasonable conclusions:
1. Belief with the mouth is not what Jesus wants
2. Belief is with the heart as this leads to righteousness and good works
3. Those who follow Christ will not be condemned.
4. Those who do not follow Christ will be condemned
5. Christ is the light, and those who live righteously will come to Christ
6. Those who like sin and evil will hide from Christ.

If you notice that around here, Christians never speak of following Christ's commandments. Anyone who speaks of this, are condemned as preaching works salvation and called legalistic. These types of Christians dont like the light because their evil deeds will be reproved.

The unfortunate truth is that some Christians dont really like Christ, becuase they dont like His teachings. They like Christ only with their mouth becuase they think this mouth worship gets them eternal life.