06 Jul 11
Originally posted by jaywill"The Spirit bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God" (Rom. 8:16)"
[b]======================================
What about people who are BOTH poor in spirit and AND are meek? Suppose G75 is poor in spirit, AND he is meek. Will his be the kingdom of heaven AND will he inherit the earth? Which will he be -- in the administration (your useful analogy) or the electorate? Or both, somehow?
The answer can be simple. It's ...[text shortened]... repent of that false teaching and receive Christ into their spirit to be born of God.
If you really understood this scripture and who it applies to you would not make the comments you make about the JW's.
Did Jesus not speak of ((((( 2 )))))))) flocks? Please answer this.
06 Jul 11
1 edit
Originally posted by galveston75======================================
"The Spirit bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God" (Rom. 8:16)"
If you really understood this scripture and who it applies to you would not make the comments you make about the JW's.
Did Jesus not speak of ((((( 2 )))))))) flocks? Please answer this.
Did Jesus not speak of ((((( 2 )))))))) flocks? Please answer this.
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Jesus spoke of "one flock". ((((((((John 10:16)))))))))
"And I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; I must lead them also, and they shall hear My voice, and there shall be one flock and one Shepherd." (John 10:16)
He spoke of more than one "fold" which is a temporary shelter for the sheep. But He only spoke of "one flock".
And I experience Romans 8:16 , that the Spirit bears witness with my spirit that I am a child of God, "organically" united to Him.
If it were not so I may have been deceived by the Watchtower years ago, when as a young Christian they tried to rob me of my prize, telling me that I could not be sure of my eternal salvation.
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06 Jul 11
Originally posted by galveston75So it's not a question people wrestle with, nor need you.
Well again I'm not understanding why the question is not being answered by a couple of us here to help you out. But yes a person can be both or 75% one and 25% other or any mixture in between. I have no way of know exactly the deep qualifications and heart conditions that God is looking for. The only guidlines are what anyone can read for himslf in the B ...[text shortened]... h equally and maybe deserving of both....but we don't choose who goes here or there, God does.
06 Jul 11
2 edits
Originally posted by JS357==========================================
I simply do not understand how my question can be replied to without being answered. I speculate that it contains trigger words that elicit an automatic response that bears no relation relation to the sentences I wrote. RJ is the only person who understood and answered the question, although he used the opportunity for other purposes as well.
I simply do not understand how my question can be replied to without being answered. I speculate that it contains trigger words that elicit an automatic response that bears no relation relation to the sentences I wrote. RJ is the only person who understood and answered the question, although he used the opportunity for other purposes as well.
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I read your complaint. I went back to review your question. I went back to review my answer.
I think if you muse on it a little bit you will see that I did answer your question.
It is puzzling to me that you don't find your answer.
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What about people who are BOTH poor in spirit and AND are meek? Suppose G75 is poor in spirit, AND he is meek. Will his be the kingdom of heaven AND will he inherit the earth? Which will he be -- in the administration (your useful analogy) or the electorate? Or both, somehow?
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Suppose Gal is BOTH poor in spirit and meek too ?
Neither will merit any reward if he is an unbeliever in Christ as Lord.
And in his theology, he regards that he is doing the Old Testament Jehovah a favor by downplaying the Son of God to a created angel and not God incarnate.
So in rejecting that the Word was God and became flesh, neither being poor in spirit or meek will have any effect on his receiving ANY promise specified in those passages. That is unless he receives Christ as his Lord, which we pray God will have mercy upon him to do.
Now, what about that response does not specifically address your question ?
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06 Jul 11
Originally posted by jaywillI've got all the replies I think I need and now I think I should have put this question in the Posers and Puzzles forum as it's more of a logic question. 🙂
[b]==========================================
I simply do not understand how my question can be replied to without being answered. I speculate that it contains trigger words that elicit an automatic response that bears no relation relation to the sentences I wrote. RJ is the only person who understood and answered the question, although he used the op ...[text shortened]... upon him to do.
Now, what about that response does not specifically address your question ?
Your answer rules out Gal on another basis entirely.
Forget about it being Gal. if a person is sufficiently meek and sufficiently poor in spirit such that he will inherit the earth AND his will be the kingdom of heaven; and meets all of the other requirements, will he get both? His choice? Will God decide? Is one better than the other? Or is this just not something we need to wrestle with? That's what I'm thinking now.
06 Jul 11
2 edits
Originally posted by JS357=============================
I've got all the replies I think I need and now I think I should have put this question in the Posers and Puzzles forum as it's more of a logic question. 🙂
Your answer rules out Gal on another basis entirely.
Forget about it being Gal. if a person is sufficiently meek and sufficiently poor in spirit such that he will inherit the earth AND his will be th ...[text shortened]... other? Or is this just not something we need to wrestle with? That's what I'm thinking now.
Your answer rules out Gal on another basis entirely.
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Unbelief rules out the sinner. Belief rules the sinner in.
No positive promise from Matthew 5-8 is applicable to one who rules himself out because of disbelief in Christ as the Lord.
But he was not ruled out entirely because I said if he becomes a believer, then the rewards of that sermon are within his grasp. The message was spoken by Christ, not to the crowds in general, but to the disciples specifically.
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Forget about it being Gal. if a person is sufficiently meek and sufficiently poor in spirit such that he will inherit the earth AND his will be the kingdom of heaven; and meets all of the other requirements, will he get both? His choice? Will God decide? Is one better than the other? Or is this just not something we need to wrestle with? That's what I'm thinking now.
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I think maybe I see your point.
There will be some who will inherit the earth who are not participating in the kingdom of the heavens.
Again, there will be SOME people who will inherit the earth in the millennial kingdom who are not participating in the kingdom of the heavens.
Probably, no one reading this discussion will be among that type of people.
But this only God knows for sure.
That is the shortest possible reply I would offer now to your question.
Out of the time of the great tribulation, some people will be transfered into the next age to inherit the earth. They may not have heard of the gospel preached in the church age.
My opinion is that no one reading this discussion, and no one actively fighting AGAINST the Gospel of Christ, will be among those blessed ones.
Jehovah's Witnesses FIGHT AGAINST the Gospel of Christ and preach "another Jesus".
06 Jul 11
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Is one better than the other?
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To possess the kingdom of the heavens is not about GOING to heaven. Maybe you read my comments on that.
But between being those under the rule of the constituents of the kingdom of the heavens as those inheriting the earth, it is better to be a participant in the kingdom. For that is closer to the eternal purpose of God.
But for the sons of God to reign there must be someones for them to reign over. So both are wonderful. But to be a son of God with the life of God is the eternal plan of God and is far better.
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06 Jul 11
Originally posted by jaywillWell presumably it will be a good reign. There won't be any birthers. 🙂
[b]============================
Is one better than the other?
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To possess the kingdom of the heavens is not about GOING to heaven. Maybe you read my comments on that.
But between being those under the rule of the constituents of the kingdom of the heavens as those inheriting the earth, it is better to be a ...[text shortened]... erful. But to be a son of God with the life of God is the eternal plan of God and is far better.[/b]
07 Jul 11
Originally posted by jaywillSo are you judging me?
[b]==========================================
I simply do not understand how my question can be replied to without being answered. I speculate that it contains trigger words that elicit an automatic response that bears no relation relation to the sentences I wrote. RJ is the only person who understood and answered the question, although he used the op ...[text shortened]... upon him to do.
Now, what about that response does not specifically address your question ?
07 Jul 11
To answer your OP
A Multitude from the Tribulation
9 After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could count, from every nation and all tribes and peoples and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed in white robes, and palm branches were in their hands; 10 and they cry out with a loud voice, saying,
“Salvation to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb.” 11 And all the angels were standing around the throne and around the elders and the four living creatures; and they fell on their faces before the throne and worshiped God, 12 saying,
“Amen, blessing and glory and wisdom and thanksgiving and honor and power and might, be to our God forever and ever. Amen.”
13 Then one of the elders answered, saying to me, “These who are clothed in the white robes, who are they, and where have they come from?” 14 I said to him, “My lord, you know.” And he said to me, “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. 15 For this reason, they are before the throne of God; and they serve Him day and night in His temple; and He who sits on the throne will spread His tabernacle over them. 16 They will hunger no longer, nor thirst anymore; nor will the sun beat down on them, nor any heat; 17 for the Lamb in the center of the throne will be their shepherd, and will guide them to springs of the water of life; and God will wipe every tear from their eyes.”
from www.biblegateway.com NASB version
Looking at this I see two things the power and authority of the Lamb and He is said to be where? At the Center of the throne and the fluidity of the way it is written shows and proves that the Lamb is to be worshiped. Also the great multitude is
where? They are before the throne of God not on earth. However heaven is where ever the throne of God is. So earth or Heaven irrelevant!!
Manny
07 Jul 11
Originally posted by JS357======================================
Well presumably it will be a good reign. There won't be any birthers. 🙂
Well presumably it will be a good reign. There won't be any birthers.
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From the perspective of the kingdom people, it is not a matter of waiting to see. Today is the time to be under His reign, which of course is very good.
07 Jul 11
Originally posted by RJHindsPlease read the end of the book of Revelation when it warns of adding to or removing words from this book. Then ask yourself if it is or is not a "big deal".
The insertion of Jehovah is no big deal. It is all the other changes they
did to try to deny Jesus the proper honor He desires as the second
person of the Trinity that I think is despicable.
07 Jul 11
5 edits
Originally posted by galveston75===============================
So are you judging me?
So are you judging me?
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The Apostle John wrote to us saying:
"Everyone who goes beyond and does not abide in the teaching of Christ does not have God: he who abides in the teaching, he has both the Father and the Son. If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your house, and do not say to him, Rejoice! For he who says to him, Rejoice, shares in his evil works." (2 John 8-11)
This is what I have judged. I have judged that you and the organization that sent you, does not abide in the teaching of Christ. I judge that you do not have the Father or the Son and that I should not welcome Jehovah's Witnesses into my house to encourage them in their false teaching.
That much about you I do judge. How can I obey the Apostle John's exhortation unless I judge discerningly, at least to this extent ?
Of course I also judge that there is still time for you to receive Christ as Lord and to repent of teaching "another Jesus" of the Watchtower's invention.
Though I do judge what you are doing to this extent, you might one day thank God that I was a friend to you. A true friend tells people the truth. And by telling you that you need to get out of that Jehovah's Witness false Gospel and receive Christ as Lord, I am telling you the truth.
A true friend tells his fellow man the truth when his fellow man is in real danger.
08 Jul 11
Originally posted by jaywillI appreciate the advice............
[b]===============================
So are you judging me?
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The Apostle John wrote to us saying:
"Everyone who goes beyond and does not abide in the teaching of Christ does not have God: he who abides in the teaching, he has both the Father and the Son. If anyone comes to you and does not br ...[text shortened]... rue friend tells his fellow man the [b]truth when his fellow man is in real danger.[/b]
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08 Jul 11
Originally posted by jaywillThere wouldn't be any choice about that. The choice would only be whether to be an outlaw.
[b]======================================
Well presumably it will be a good reign. There won't be any birthers.
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From the perspective of the kingdom people, it is not a matter of waiting to see. Today is the time to be under His reign, which of course is very good.[/b]