Fearful Unbelief

Originally posted by karoly aczel
Other than :"Get enlightened", life has no meaning. Even "get enlightened" is meaningless because humans put meaning into things which just aint there. I've had a few rude shocks in my life where I've realized that all my lofty thoughts, etc. didn't amount to anything really.

There is no barrier between us and the "rest" except for the ones we put th ...[text shortened]... eaking down these barriers is a sort of purpose in life, but still there is no meaning.

Just so: accept the gift and move on.

Originally posted by FMF
Only choice? Not so. There's also the choice to simply embrace life, savour it for all its richness and meaning, and not attempt to add some hypothetical "additional meaning" to it by speculating about unknown things, such as whether "the soul lives forever".

See above response.

Originally posted by Beyer
Given that there's no such thing as a soul, and our only choice is whether or not we should believe in it, what keeps the believer in such a state? Meaning, why not simply reject this absurd notion and move on?

See above response, which refers to the response above it.

Originally posted by finnegan
I am not drowning but waving. These silly, false and empty choices are just debating points - they have no value, no depth.

Oy. You know the drill.

Originally posted by whodey
Your lofty thoughts may not amount to a hill of beans but this is OUR hill and this is OUR beans!!

Sorry, I heard this in a movie once and it cracks me up every time I hear it.

Anyhew, your post reminds me of Ecclesiasties where Solomon comes to the conclusion that all is vanity. In fact, wisdom and intellect only brings vexation of spirit. Perhaps you can relate.

Yes. I can relate. But I'm not sure if it is exactly the same.

So I've had like unbelievable , transcendental experiences that have totally changed the core of my being, my whole person, but when I've gone to tell others about these experiences I've just come off sounding like a crackpot.

I've since started to become more patient and not so worried about it, but still, I saw what I saw. I don't need anyone to verifry that.

I really have seen that we are all special and that the lies that have been perpetuated by ignorance for generations have held us back from realizing our true potential. Jesus has his part to play, but then so do we all. 🙂

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
See above response.

I am starting to realize that you are what might be described as 'beyond parody'.

Originally posted by karoly aczel
I really have seen that we are all special and that the lies that have been perpetuated by ignorance for generations have held us back from realizing our true potential. Jesus has his part to play, but then so do we all. 🙂[/b]

What I find interesting is your last comment about Jesus. In fact, he is universally seen as "enlightened". What other figure can we say this about? In fact, it seems as though all world religions want a piece of the man called Jesus Christ even though they may not embrace what he proported to have said and/or interpret it to fit their theology....except maybe the Jews. LOL. So what other world figures can we say this about?

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Given that the soul lives forever and our only choice is where we shall spend that existence, what keeps the unbeliever in such a state? Meaning, why not simply accept a free gift and move on?

Nothing is ever free.

In order to accept this gift one only need to bend their knee swear fealty to a spiritual dictator. Not for me. See you in Hell biotch!

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Given that the soul lives forever and our only choice is where we shall spend that existence, what keeps the unbeliever in such a state? Meaning, why not simply accept a free gift and move on?

I totally fail to see how the second question follows from the first.
In the first you suggest a given then ask why people do not believe it. In the second, you ask why a believer would choose not to accept the free gift. I personally do not see why anyone would knowingly choose not to accept such a free gift (if it is a free choice and free gift as claimed).
I doubt that Starrman would reject it even though he claims otherwise.
But that is not the issue in the first question at all. The first question asks why people do not believe, and that has nothing whatsoever to do with the ease with which a believer may accept a free gift and move on.

Originally posted by FMF
I am starting to realize that you are what might be described as 'beyond parody'.

I'll have a go.

"Assuming Manchester City was unbeatable, why would any other team think they could beat them?"

Nope.

FreakyKBH's version of this silliness is funnier than the attempted parody.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Just so: accept the gift and move on.

If a gift is offered , I will probably accept it. I am not proud in that way and believe that learning to recieve is just as important as learning to give.

Originally posted by whodey
What I find interesting is your last comment about Jesus. In fact, he is universally seen as "enlightened". What other figure can we say this about? In fact, it seems as though all world religions want a piece of the man called Jesus Christ even though they may not embrace what he proported to have said and/or interpret it to fit their theology....except maybe the Jews. LOL. So what other world figures can we say this about?

I am not even entirely sure if Jesus was enlightened or was just a bhoddisattva.
So in line with not being "entirely sure", I would add to that list the lineage of Zen masters, Osho, Krsna, Mohammed and the other 15 avatars of Hinduism. I see all these figures as being just as integral to the evolution of conciousness on this planet as Jesus.
I am open to being corrected or for this list to be added to

Originally posted by FMF
I am starting to realize that you are what might be described as 'beyond parody'.

I've worked awfully hard on that, and I appreciate you noticing the same.

Originally posted by Ullr
Nothing is ever free.

In order to accept this gift one only need to bend their knee swear fealty to a spiritual dictator. Not for me. See you in Hell biotch!

Nothing is ever free.
Is this unsolicited advice?

In order to accept this gift one only need to bend their knee swear fealty to a spiritual dictator.
Not true. Condition of acceptance is simple acceptance: His work for my work. Nothing more, nothing less.

See you in Hell biotch!
Not likely.

Originally posted by twhitehead
I totally fail to see how the second question follows from the first.
In the first you suggest a given then ask why people do not believe it. In the second, you ask why a believer would choose not to accept the free gift. I personally do not see why anyone would knowingly choose not to accept such a free gift (if it is a free choice and free gift as clai ...[text shortened]... nothing whatsoever to do with the ease with which a believer may accept a free gift and move on.

In the first you suggest a given then ask why people do not believe it.
The question doesn't refer to the veracity of the given; it asks why a person would choose to reject a free gift--- thereby categorizing themselves as unbelievers.

What I am suggesting is to set aside the normal debate about spirituality (God's or the soul's existence) and consider the question from the standpoint of self-determining the soul's eternal destination.

You get to choose where your soul will exist for all of eternity. Acceptance of a gift (free to you, not free in its establishment) positions your soul in the most pleasurable place imaginable; rejection of the gift keeps you as far away from pleasure as imaginable. Which do you choose?