Originally posted by galveston75Do you believe that Revelation was Jesus taking to someone in a dream? If so, why?
Lol. I believe I am addressing the thread.
We read in the bible what Jesus said only on a small level of what he no doubt spoke to these men who followed him.
There were many, many hours of conversation on many things that they no doubt had in their many hours of travel and associations with each other.
Not ever word spoken between them was writt ...[text shortened]... o ones such as Paul who would have written down these deeper explinations and thoughts of Jesus.
Originally posted by FreakyKBHSeems like you agree that the claim quoted in the OP is false.
In order to fully understand what is taught, several things are first required.
Who?
Said what?
To whom?
How was it conveyed?
Where?
When?
Why?
If any part of these requirements are missing, the cake will end up tasting like something other--- usually not pleasant.
The sayings of the Lord Jesus Christ are so often misconstrued, misapplied ...[text shortened]... ng, padded cell and adequate caregiving--- assuming such a person makes it out alive, of course.
Care to answer the question given in the OP?
Seems like Christians often make statements like the one quoted above. What's the reason for this when it's clearly not true?
Originally posted by ThinkOfOneIt's speculation, of course.
Seems like you agree that the claim quoted in the OP is false.
Care to answer the question given in the OP?Seems like Christians often make statements like the one quoted above. What's the reason for this when it's clearly not true?
I would venture to say that most believers have un-examined faith, and (for them), the Lord Jesus Christ is thought of in iconic terms: He is the token that gets them entrance to the fun house, and they wouldn't recognize Him without His posse of angels around Him.
For others, there is a conscious disconnect between what He said and what the rest of the NT says... and they simply trust that Paul and the other writers have spun gold thread from the gold nuggets, even if they don't know how it was done.
Others still see that the Lord Jesus Christ said some of the hardest to understand things ever uttered by a man of flesh. They understand that some things were meant for some people in certain times, others for others at different times and only a few things for everyone at all times.
These folks also understand that the other writers in the NT speak almost exclusively to those who are in the Church Age, informed as they were by the Holy Spirit to convey the mystery doctrine for this esteemed group of believers.
This doesn't make them any more or any less Christian for getting their cues from the apostles; they're simply following protocol.
Originally posted by galveston75Sounds like wild speculation.
Lol. I believe I am addressing the thread.
We read in the bible what Jesus said only on a small level of what he no doubt spoke to these men who followed him.
There were many, many hours of conversation on many things that they no doubt had in their many hours of travel and associations with each other.
Not ever word spoken between them was writt ...[text shortened]... o ones such as Paul who would have written down these deeper explinations and thoughts of Jesus.
What isn't speculative is that Jesus emphasized the importance of HIS words. For example:
John 14
23Jesus answered and said to him, “If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him. 24“He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine, but the Father’s who sent Me.
Jesus explicitly states that it is HIS words that need to be kept.
If Paul had access to words of Jesus that were not quoted elsewhere in the Bible, then they should have been quoted. Why wouldn't Paul have quoted Jesus given the emphasis Jesus gives to HIS words?
Originally posted by FreakyKBHBut why make the claim?
It's speculation, of course.
I would venture to say that most believers have un-examined faith, and (for them), the Lord Jesus Christ is thought of in iconic terms: He is the token that gets them entrance to the fun house, and they wouldn't recognize Him without His posse of angels around Him.
For others, there is a conscious disconnect between what ...[text shortened]... less Christian for getting their cues from the apostles; they're simply following protocol.
Christianity is based upon the teachings of Christ, a Christian is one who adopts and applies those teachings.
Why not just acknowledge that "Christianity is based upon the teachings [of the Bible on the whole], a Christian is one who adopts and applies those teachings"?
Beyond that, why don't they just acknowledge that "Christianity is based upon [various subsets and/or extrapolations of] the teachings [of the Bible on the whole], a Christian is one who adopts and applies [one of the subsets and/or extrapolations of] those teachings.
"?
Originally posted by galveston75The claim that Revelation is "the testimony of Jesus Christ" is mentioned repeatedly at the beginning of Revelation.
I already answered this in my previous post. Here is my answer again. Jehovah God was the author of the bible which would include Revelation.
Jesus, Jehovah's son was not the author of the Bible.