15 Jan 09
Originally posted by no1marauderNot easy or practical to enforce especially when score sheets not collected.
Try the same "strategy" in a USCF OTB tournament and see what happens.
USCF Rule 20L Manipulating Results. Collusion to fix or throw games, [b] whether before or during a game in order to manipulate prize money, title norms, ratings, or for any other purpose is illegal and may result in severe sanctions, including revocation of USCF membership.[/b]
Also there is a distinction between agreeing to a draw and fixing games.
Additionally the rule was done away in the last round in last year's US Championship:
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1493558
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15 Jan 09
1 edit
Properly fixing games would be agreeing to win a game and 3 points each. This can easily be done by copying known games between decent players. And who would notice then?
Draws of convenience are part of serious chess: for securing tournament prizes, for obtaining norms. In this tournament with a stellar number of games going on, this discussion makes me yawn.
Both players found this the way that serves their interest best. None of them is giving anything away or selling out.
The very rules at RHP where equal points mean several players can progress, make their approach reasonable. Both are still taking a gamble though.
15 Jan 09
Originally posted by paulbuchmanfromficsIts not against the rules so don't worry about it.
It's nice that a friend has to tell me that I am being publicly riduculed in a thread. I was under the impression that you could have a draw whenever you agreed on it. It's not like I tried to hide it. I could have messaged the guy and said let's play thirty moves and then agree to a draw. Why in the world should I try to juggle so many games ...[text shortened]... me it's good tournament strategy. If it's against the rules HERE, that's another matter.
I have done it mwself loads of times usually for the perfectly valid reason that I have too many games and too little time so it pays to quickly draw the game likely to take the most time then focus on the rest.
In my opinion good tournament strategy for the 2 strongest players.
15 Jan 09
Originally posted by no1marauderYou can be such a nasty piece of work can't you.
There is no God, but there is the Law of Karma i.e. the effects of all deeds actively create past, present, and future experiences, thus making one responsible for one's own life, and the pain and joy it brings to him/her and others.
I suggest you spend some time meditating on that.
A previous sprat with you in the forum got me to cancel my subscription, now you have succeeded in doing it to someone else.
How many paying subscribers are you driving away from this site?
15 Jan 09
Originally posted by paulbuchmanfromficsNeedless to act this way I reckon; the site has nothing to do with the attitude and with the personal opinion of each individual, who at last has the right to behave the way s/he wants;
Wah Wah
You didn't play for a win.
Wah Wah
That's what it all comes down to.
afx is mad because I didn't lose points.
He brings it to a public forum. (unethical???)
You take it upon yourself to have others ban me.
And I am the one in the wrong.
Congratulations
You just cost the site another subscriber.
This isn't ab ...[text shortened]... abused for doing something that I don't think is wrong seems IMMORAL and UNETHICAL to me.
there is an issue anyway; you made your point clear, No1 made his his point clear, and for sure there are people operating over here, eager and capable and authorised to offer the proper solution. If your two draws are against the RHP rules, well, you will soon be formally informed.
That's all🙂
For the time being enjoy the royal game -and postpone your answer to me in case you wish to avoid a spectacular defeat, that is😵
15 Jan 09
Originally posted by Dragon FireJust saw this thread - what's the big deal.
Its not against the rules so don't worry about it.
I have done it mwself loads of times usually for the perfectly valid reason that I have too many games and too little time so it pays to quickly draw the game likely to take the most time then focus on the rest.
In my opinion good tournament strategy for the 2 strongest players.
If I was playing in a tournament and was one of the top two players
and the other player said let's agree two short draw so we can
concetrate on the rest. Yes. Good thinking.
This is not a weekend congress with bucks at stake.
It's a site where you can be playing 20-30 games at once - hence
OTB rules are out the window.
It makes good sense to drop a couple of quick draws to ease the load.
15 Jan 09
Originally posted by Dragon FireNaughty naughty Dragon Fire.
What about
Game 2721323; or
Game 2721320.
Maybe
Game 2701323; or
Game 2701324.
Hang your head in shame and send yourself a fair play ticket.
Fancy a series of short move draws? 😉
What a load of fuss over 6 moves.
15 Jan 09
Originally posted by no1marauderfirst: this is not the uscf, so their rules do not apply. If Paul has broken a site rule, then by all means send in a fair play ticket.
I did some more research. Here's what I found:
USCF Rule 14B6 Premature or Prearranged Draws
It is unethical and unsporting to agree to a draw before a serious contest has begun. The same is true of all agreements to prearrange game results. In case of clear violations of the moral principles of the game, penalties should be imposed at the director's discretion.
second: In otb play one only has to worry about the game in front of them. In cc internet chess players sometimes have hundreds of games going. Its good strategy to get a draw in as game that would otherwise drain excessive time that the player may not have available (most of us have lives outside rhp). There is no money at stake, no trophy, and the results in no way effect anyones daily life. I think its a non issue.
15 Jan 09
1 edit
Sorry for starting the theme of the draws.
I was just shirty, when I saw these two draws, first.
But the special rules of RHP make a clear difference to the normal
tournaments:
Here we have the 3 points for a win and 1 point for a draw ( so the
USCF OTB tournament rules are absolutely inadequate here!)
So here the guys, who make draws, have no advantage (lesser games),
but a disadvantage: My chances as number 3 even rise.
It would have been a different situation, when they did not make draws
but a win and a loss, so both would get 3 instead of 2 points.
But the both players made it the fair way, there is absolutely no
reason for critisism.
Sorry for any inconveniences
16 Jan 09
Originally posted by afxSickening that peer pressure makes a player back away from a legitimate complaint that others are acting in a disgraceful manner to enhance their own chances to advance. Grow a backbone, afx.
Sorry for starting the theme of the draws.
I was just shirty, when I saw these two draws, first.
But the special rules of RHP make a clear difference to the normal
tournaments:
Here we have the 3 points for a win and 1 point for a draw ( so the
USCF OTB tournament rules are absolutely inadequate here!)
So here the guys, who make draws, have no advantage ...[text shortened]... it the fair way, there is absolutely no
reason for critisism.
Sorry for any inconveniences
Those players are seeking to avoid having to play difficult games so they can concentrate on their games with lower rated players. One admitted he did it to increase his chances of winning the tournament. His evaluation that it will help him advance is far more probable than the after the fact justifications dreamed up by others here to excuse what chess associations know is unethical and unsporting behavior. If you're not prepared to make your best effort in a game, you shouldn't play just like the USCF Code of Ethics says.