Originally posted by FMFAttempting to counter "ludicrous hyperbole" by employing your own "ludicrous hyperbole" is ludicrous.
whodey, as ever, is unable to substantiate any of his claims about the existence or non-existence or disappearance of the very real, practical and empowering personal and political freedoms that you have in your country and that I have listed. How can a list of basic freedoms be "hyperbole"? How can me asking him to substantiate his claims be "dumb"?
Originally posted by lemon limeI'll ignore the silly straw-man-approaching question of whether or not there is a country in the world where all its people are free to do whatever they want to do, as it is reducto as absurdum nonsense that you have introduced and not me.
Anyone one who lives in the U.S., whether they are right or left leaning, or religious or not, can tell you they are not free to do anything and everything they want to do. No civilized country in the world can make that claim. Can you name one country in the world where all the people of that country are free to do what ever they want to do?
As I put it to whodey, people in his country have almost complete freedom do whatever they want, be whatever they want, think whatever they want, say whatever they want, read and write whatever they want, associate with whoever they want, follow whatever career you want, educate their children how they want, believe in whatever God they want, believe and not believe whatever they want, travel wherever they want, live where they want, buy what they want, and engage in whatever business or activities they want.
He cannot substantiate either of his claims: that his "every move" is "micromanged" by the government; or that his current president has "fundamentally changed" any one of the freedoms listed.
Originally posted by FMFThere are a lot of people in this country who believe they have all of the rights you have enumerated, and you can find many of those same people in prisons. What you have actually described is what any self centered narcissist might believe are his rights. It's either that, or you must think the U.S. is the closest thing to nirvana and heaven people can experience on earth.
I'll ignore the silly straw-man-approaching question of whether or not there is a country in the world where all its people are free to do whatever they want to do, as it is reducto as absurdum nonsense that you have introduced and not me.
As I put it to whodey, people in his country have almost complete freedom do whatever they want, be whatever they want, t ...[text shortened]... nment; or that his current president has "fundamentally changed" any one of the freedoms listed.
Originally posted by lemon limeI haven't mentioned "nirvana" or "heaven". These are things you have introduced into the conversation, not me. Why won't whodey substantiate his hyperbolic claims?
There are a lot of people in this country who believe they have all of the rights you have enumerated, and you can find many of those same people in prisons. What you have actually described is what any self centered narcissist might believe are his rights. It's either that, or you must think the U.S. is the closest thing to nirvana and heaven people can experience on earth.
Originally posted by FMFNot "every move" is micromanaged by the government, but it's true that over the years our government has wandered from the boundaries of its constitutional authority, and into areas it was once prohibited from exercising authority. But you would only know this if 1.) you lived here and 2.) lived here long enough to see these changes taking place for yourself and 3.) if you were able to recognize how (over time) freedoms here have been gradually replaced by an increasing dependence on government aid and direction.
I'll ignore the silly straw-man-approaching question of whether or not there is a country in the world where all its people are free to do whatever they want to do, as it is reducto as absurdum nonsense that you have introduced and not me.
As I put it to whodey, people in his country have almost complete freedom do whatever they want, be whatever they want, t ...[text shortened]... nment; or that his current president has "fundamentally changed" any one of the freedoms listed.
Where I live the homeless population has managed to stay ahead of the places built and leased to house and feed the homeless... if you build it, they will come. I've talked to homeless people who used to travel around the country, and they decided to settle in and make the city I live in their home. The transients and homeboys here all say the same thing, they say you can't starve in Portland. And they're right, but for our effort to help by building new places to house and feed them all we ended up getting in return are many more homeless people... and the only ones I've seen who actually benefited from all of the programs and places for the homeless are the people who got federal and state grants for the purpose of helping the homeless.
If you give a man a fish (and that's all you do) you not only feed him for a day, but the next day he could show up with someone else wanting a fish. So you show up the day after with two fish, and three guys show up looking for a free meal. This is (in a nutshell) what has been happening in Portland over the past 30 years.
12 Mar 15
Originally posted by lemon limeSo neither of us agree with whodey's claim, then.
Not "every move" is micromanaged by the government, but it's true that over the years our government has wandered from the boundaries of its constitutional authority, and into areas it was once prohibited from exercising authority.
Originally posted by lemon limeNo one is forcing you discuss anything with non-U.S. residents. Which of the real and practical freedoms I listed are no longer in existence or under threat of disappearing? Are people free to not be dependent on "government aid and direction" if that is what they choose?
But you would only know this if 1.) you lived here and 2.) lived here long enough to see these changes taking place for yourself and 3.) if you were able to recognize how (over time) freedoms here have been gradually replaced by an increasing dependence on government aid and direction.
Originally posted by whodeyAfter having thus successfully taken each member of the community in its powerful grasp and fashioned him at will, the supreme power then extends its arm over the whole community. It covers the surface of society with a network of small complicated rules, minute and uniform, through which the most original minds and the most energetic characters cannot penetrate, to rise above the crowd. The will of man is not shattered, but softened, bent, and guided; men are seldom forced by it to act, but they are constantly restrained from acting. Such a power does not destroy, but prevents existence; it does not tyrannize, but it compresses, enervates, extinguishes, and stupefies a people, till each nation is reduced to nothing better than a flock of timid and industrious animals, of which the government is the shepherd."
If you don't have the will, gumption or personal life skills to fully exercise the very real, practical and empowering personal and political freedoms that I listed (and which you have studiously refused to address), and you perhaps see yourself instead as 'someone whose will has been softened, compressed, enervated, extinguished, and stupefied and that you have been reduced to being a member of a flock of timid and industrious animals' [I've taken this from your copy paste above], then man-up and just speak for yourself and your own personal/political impotence, and stop trying to smear everyone around you with your abject and facetious misanthropy.
12 Mar 15
Originally posted by robbie carrobiePlease read the Treaty of Tripoli 1799. The US is not a Christian country as per John Adams (Founding Father).
I have no one in particular in mind. I was commenting on the phenomena whereby a country which claims to be predominately Christian and thus to reflect Christian values can so utterly miss or repress or somehow misconstrue the very values from which they take their alleged identity. If you have anything to say without the usual recourse to personali ...[text shortened]... d be pleased if you spared me the tedium of your trolling attempts, transparent though they are.
12 Mar 15
Originally posted by caissad4Ben Carson: Obama Says ‘We Are Not a Judeo-Christian Nation’ – But He Doesn’t Get to Decide, We Do
Please read the Treaty of Tripoli 1799. The US is not a Christian country as per John Adams (Founding Father).
Back on April 6, 2009, during a press conference with the president of Turkey, President Obama said, "Although as I mentioned, we have a very large Christian population, we do not consider ourselves a Christian nation or a Jewish nation or a Muslim nation. We consider ourselves a nation of citizens who are bound by ideals and a set of values. I think modern Turkey was founded with a similar set of principles.”
http://cnsnews.com/news/article/michael-w-chapman/ben-carson-obama-says-we-are-not-judeo-christian-nation-he-doesn-t
12 Mar 15
Originally posted by lemon limeFor instance, how well do you think a Rastafarian would do in Salt Lake City? In terms of seeking office, say, or seeking employment or making friends with the local Mormons?
Anyone one who lives in the U.S., whether they are right or left leaning, or religious or not, can tell you they are not free to do anything and everything they want to do. No civilized country in the world can make that claim. Can you name one country in the world where all the people of that country are free to do what ever they want to do?
Originally posted by caissad4you built settlements, you built churches in those settlements, you sustained clergy, you were as Christian a nation as it gets. Now its probably different, I dunno.
Please read the Treaty of Tripoli 1799. The US is not a Christian country as per John Adams (Founding Father).