The Human Spirit

@fmf said
Fair enough. You are of course speaking for yourself and your own inability to comprehend things. If "the human spirit" is actually, in your personal opinion, "incomprehensible to [your] natural mind", I wonder what else you might contribute to this thread,

What else might I contribute?

If, as I said, spirit is incomprehensible to [the] "natural" mind, I might seek to contribute to the comprehension by [your] mind how to comprehend spirit.

If, in fact, spirit is incomprehensible to [your] natural mind, then by what means is spirit comprehensible?

Answer: by the regeneration of the spirit.

@secondson said
What else might I contribute?

If, as you concede, you find this topic "incomprehensible", then I'd suggest you probably have little or nothing to contribute. Thanks all the same.

@secondson said
If, as I said, spirit is incomprehensible to [the] "natural" mind, I might seek to contribute to the comprehension by [your] mind how to comprehend spirit.

If, in fact, spirit is incomprehensible to [your] natural mind, then by what means is spirit comprehensible?

Answer: by the regeneration of the spirit.

I reckon all your stuff about our "natural" minds and ~ by extension ~ our supposedly different 'supernatural' minds [which, I take it, you think you have to some degree, and I don't] is all dogmatic drivel.

@fmf said
I reckon all your stuff about our "natural" minds and ~ by extension ~ our supposedly different 'supernatural' minds [which, I take it, you think you have to some degree, and I don't] is all dogmatic drivel.

Drivel is it?
With that you squelch discussion because to you it is drivel.

Regeneration isn't drivel, and it's not dogmatism.

It's just where your natural mind comes to the limit of its capacity to comprehend Spirit.

It is in fact what the Bible teaches. And yes you don't have it. Obviously.

And the fact that I do causes you some form of mental grief your intellect is unable to cope with, so you call it drivel as a means of escaping from the discussion.

If I told you once, I told you a hundred times. You must be born again.

But because I'm being honest and open with you, and because
unless you trivialize the matter, and belittle it, to give you a sense of strength in the weakness of your argument against it, you resort to the default mode of duck and run with sputterings of "stuff" and "dogmatic drivel".

What are you even doing here? For that matter, what am I doing here debating with someone that is as pathetic a debate opponent as you? You wait a day to come back with "dogmatic drivel"? Pathetic.

@secondson said
Drivel is it?
With that you squelch discussion because to you it is drivel.

Suggesting that there is some sort of "supernatural" thing that has happened to you that precludes people who are not members of your religion from understanding that what you are saying is "true", is a threadbare rhetorical cop-out, yes.

If ever there were an attempt to "squelch" a discussion, it would be pretentious and self-serving drivel about the supposed limits of the "natural mind" that - hey presto - you are able to overcome because of whatever religious dogma you happen to have internalized.

@secondson said
It's just where your natural mind comes to the limit of its capacity to comprehend Spirit.

It is in fact what the Bible teaches. And yes you don't have it. Obviously.

And the fact that I do causes you some form of mental grief your intellect is unable to cope with, so you call it drivel as a means of escaping from the discussion.

If I told you once, I told you a hu ...[text shortened]... t, you resort to the default mode of duck and run with sputterings of "stuff" and "dogmatic drivel".

Thanks for all this.

@secondson said
What are you even doing here? For that matter, what am I doing here debating with someone that is as pathetic a debate opponent as you? You wait a day to come back with "dogmatic drivel"? Pathetic.

If, as you said at the outset, you find the topic of the human spirit to be "incomprehensible" and beyond the capacity of your mind, so be it. Thanks for chipping in.

@secondson said
It's just where your natural mind comes to the limit of its capacity to comprehend Spirit.It is in fact what the Bible teaches. And yes you don't have it. Obviously.And the fact that I do causes you some form of mental grief your intellect is unable to cope with

So your debating point is that you have the capacity to comprehend what the human spirit is and I don't. Check. This is because of some "limit" on my mind that doesn't apply to your mind. Check. Your assertions about yourself cause me "mental grief". Check. It's about my "intellect". Check.

@secondson said
If I told you once, I told you a hundred times. You must be born again.

What about the human spirit of Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, Sikhs, and adherents of Confucianism, Hinduism, Jainism, Judaism, Shinto, Taoism, and Zoroastrianism.

And what about the human spirit of deists, agnostics, and atheists? You have been asked for a definition of "the human spirit". Unless you believe that only Christians have the human spirit - and if you do, you should just come out and say so - then perhaps your definition ought to encompass and apply to some of the groups and types of people listed above, no?

Here is the OP again: Aside from being a descriptor that alludes to attributes that differentiate us from other living creatures, and perhaps differentiate us from each other, what do you think the human spirit is?

@fmf said
If, as you said at the outset, you find the topic of the human spirit to be "incomprehensible" and beyond the capacity of your mind, so be it. Thanks for chipping in.

I didn't say that. You are lying.

@secondson said
I didn't say that. You are lying.

Your first post on page 1, if anyone is interested.

@fmf said
So your debating point is that you have the capacity to comprehend what the human spirit is and I don't. Check. This is because of some "limit" on my mind that doesn't apply to your mind. Check. Your assertions about yourself cause me "mental grief". Check. It's about my "intellect". Check.

Check.

1 Corinthians 2:14
But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Are you catching on now to what I'm saying? Whether or not you agree with the inference of the verse above is irrelevant.

The point is that without the "new birth" your natural mind is incapable of knowing or understanding or discerning "the things of the Spirit of God", and without the new birth one is spiritually dead with regards to the spirit.

This is not an accusation, but a statement of fact.

Whether or not you believe that those who trust in the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ have experienced the new birth is irrelevant to the fact of that experience. Your disbelief makes it no less real.

If you don't think you need a savior, then you are spiritually dead in your sins, and will never know what true spirituality is until you give up your pride.

You may hate the sound of it, but that's what the Bible teaches.

@fmf said
Your first post on page 1, if anyone is interested.

If you're interested go back and read what I said, and stop misquoting and mischaracterizating what was actually said.

Or is lying your way?

@secondson said
Check.

1 Corinthians 2:14
But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Are you catching on now to what I'm saying? Whether or not you agree with the inference of the verse above is irrelevant.

The point is that without the "new birth" your nat ...[text shortened]... is until you give up your pride.

You may hate the sound of it, but that's what the Bible teaches.

You believe you have some sort of 'supernatural' mind - as opposed to a "natural mind" - because you believe in Jesus? Is that what you are offering here?

This is what you are saying about the supposed inaccessibility / incomprehensibility [to people who read the Bible but are not convinced by it] of a religious doctrine that you just so happen to have rote-learned and internalized, is that it?

Your "natural mind" has been turned into some kind of 'supernatural' mind, that's what you're claiming?

@secondson said
If you're interested go back and read what I said, and stop misquoting and mischaracterizating what was actually said.

Or is lying your way?

People can decide for themselves.