The Father is greater than I

@divegeester

You've been scrapping at the bottom of the barrel so long your fingernails must be shaved off. No significance points have I seen from you except the tired cycle:

plagiarism - bad Christian behavior - sound upset - angry - have to check with leaders - nobody reads you - should be not spending time here - then back around to some form of plagiarism accusation.

And the cycle repeats again and again.
It is more a matter of the subsiding of my boredom with you.

Excuse me.
There are still some good points I have about the Triune God seen in Revelation,
INCLUDING the Son who said "the Father is greater than I"

These passages reveal the Son who said "the Father is greater than I" is the Second Person of the Triune God.

" . . . and upon the throne there was One sitting; And He who was sitting was like a jasper stone and a sardius in appearance . . . (4:2,3)

This is a vision of the Father as the Creator.

" And there were seven lamps of fire burning before the throne, which are the seven Spirits of God." (v.5)

This is a vision of eternal Spirit as the Third Person of the Triune God.

Now in the next chapter the Son as the Lamb of God is seen as the Second Person of the Triune God, He who said "the Father is greater than I".

"And I saw in the midst of the throne and of the four living creatures and in the midst of the elders a Lamb standing as having just been slain, having seen horns and seven eyes which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth." (5:6)

The eternal Spirit as the seven lamps of chapter four are now here as the seven eyes of the Lamb in chapter five.

In incarnation God has become a Redeeming Lamb and His eyes are the seven Spirits of God, the eternal Spirit. The Third of the Triune God are the very eyes of the Second of the Triune God.

In the eyes of any person are the window into that person's soul. The Creator God incarnating as a man was conceived by the Holy Spirit (Luke 1:26-38; Matt. 1:18)

In incarnation the Lamb of God, the man has eyes which are the eternal Third Person of the Spirit of God. The seven lamps before God become the seven eyes of the God-man, the Lamb, the Redeemer. And He as the seven Spirits are sent forth into all the earth.

For "the last Adam became a life giving Spirit" (1 Cor. 15:45) and
"Now the Lord is the Spirit" (2 Cor. 3:17)

We can be assured that chapters four and five portray the Triune God because of the salutation of the whole book in chapter one.

"John to the seven churches which are in Asia: Grace to you and peace from Him who is and who was and who is coming,

and from the seven Spirits who are before His throne,

and from Jesus Christ, the faithful Witness, the Firstborn of the dead, and the Ruler of the kings of the earth. To Him who loves us and has released us from our sins by His blood and made us a kingdom, priests to His God and Father, to Him be the glory and the might forever and ever. Amen." (Rev. 1:4-6)

The Father is indicated in verse 4.
The Holy Spirit is indicated in verse 4 (the seven Spirits)
The Son is indicated in 5 and 6.

The sequence of the Three of the Godhead in chapter one agrees with the sequence
in which He is revealed in chapters four and five.

Chapter one:

The Father is indicated in verse 4.
The Holy Spirit is indicated in verse 4 (the seven Spirits)
The Son is indicated in 5 and 6.

Chapters four and five:

Upon the throne was one sitting - Father (4:2)
seven lamps of fire burning before the throne - The seven Spirits (Holy Spirit) - (v.5)
the Lamb standing - the incarnated, slain and resurrected Son - (5:6)

@Rajk999

Jesus is not God and not the Father

The One who is "Him who is and who was and who is coming" in Rev. 1:4 is God. And this One is coming on the clouds as the pierced One as "the Lord God, He who is and who was and who is coming, the Almighty." in verse 8.

When you read verses 5 the 8 you can see this is God become a man. Enjoy reading the word of God even if it is not in bold.

"And from Jesus Christ,
the faithful Witness,
the Firstborn of the dead,
and the Ruler of the kings of the earth.

To Him who loved us and has released us from our sins by His blood . . . to Him be the glory and the might forever and ever. Amen

Behold , He comes with the clouds, and every eye will see Him, even those who pierced Him; and all the tribes of the land will mourn over Him . . .

I am the Alpha and the Omega, says the Lord God,
He who is
and who was
and who is coming,
the Almighty."

The Almighty coming with the clouds whom the tribes recognize as the One their pierced on the cross is Jehovah God come as a man.

" . . . and they will look upon Me [Jehovah God whom THEY PIERCED]
and they will wail over Him with wailing as for an only son and cry bitterly over Him with bitter crying as for a firstborn son." (Zechariah 12:10)

Check your King James Version to see if it has verse references on the page of Revelation 1:7 and see if there is a reference to Zechariah 12:10.

I check everything I can carefully.
Now one might ask -

How do I know that the One speaking this is the one said to be coming on the clouds ?

"I am the Alpha and the Omega, says the Lord God,
He who is
and who was
and who is coming,
the Almighty."

How do I know that is Jesus speaking?

If should be Jesus speaking for Jesus says He is the Alpha and the Omega also in Revelation 22:13.

Behold, I come quickly, and My reward is with Me to render to each one as his work is. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End." (vs.12,13)

Of course "the Alpha and the Omega" is also "the First and the Last".
And Jesus as the Son of Man says He is that in Rev. 1:18.

"And when I saw Him, I fell at His feet as dead; and He placed His right hand on me, saying, Do not fear; I am the First and the Last and the living One; and I became dead, and behold, I am living forever and ever."

Jesus saying He is the First and the Last and the Alpha and the Omega means He is everything we need. From start to finish EVERYTHING we need is in Jesus Christ. This is the One who said "the Father is greater than I".

@sonship said
I check everything I can carefully.
Now one might ask -

How do I know that the One speaking this is the one said to be coming on the clouds ?

"I am the Alpha and the Omega, says the Lord God,
He who is
and who was
and who is coming,
the Almighty."

How do I know that is Jesus speaking?

If should be Jesus speaking for Jesus sa ...[text shortened]... ERYTHING we need is in Jesus Christ. This is the One who said "the Father is greater than I".

In the most ancient Greek manuscripts of the book of Revelation, the expression “the Alpha and the Omega” appears three times. Does this designation, as many believe, apply both to the Almighty God, Jehovah, and to his Son Jesus Christ? Just what is the significance of the title “the Alpha and the Omega”?

The word “alpha” is the name for the first letter of the Greek alphabet, whereas the term “omega” designates the last letter of the Greek alphabet. Hence, in itself, the title “the Alpha and the Omega” conveys the idea of the start and the finish or completion of a thing. The personage who is so designated would, therefore, be viewed as the beginner of certain things and the one who brings these things to a successful conclusion.

Based on what is revealed in the Hebrew Scriptures, the title “the Alpha and the Omega” would certainly fit Jehovah God. At Isaiah 55:10, 11, for example, we are told: “Just as the pouring rain descends, and the snow, from the heavens and does not return to that place, unless it actually saturates the earth and makes it produce and sprout, and seed is actually given to the sower and bread to the eater, so my word that goes forth from my mouth will prove to be. It will not return to me without results, but it will certainly do that in which I have delighted, and it will have certain success in that for which I have sent it.”

How forcefully this emphasizes that whatever Jehovah God expresses will be brought to a successful finish! Water falling in the form of rain or snow eventually filters down into the soil, there to combine with nutrients. In this way the precipitation furnishes what is needed for plant growth. In the case of grain, some of the seed may be set aside for sowing in the next season, and a far larger portion may be ground into flour for making bread. Thus the ultimate purpose of the precipitation is realized​—seed is given to the sower and bread to the eater. Likewise, whatever Jehovah God, as the Beginner, sets in motion by his word always is brought to a successful end.

But does the title “the Alpha and the Omega” apply exclusively to Jehovah God? To answer this question, we must examine the context in which this designation appears.

Revelation 1:8 states: “The Lord God says, ‘I am the Alpha and the Omega, the One who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty!’” (The New American Bible) Clearly, the reference here is to the Most High God Jehovah.

While Jesus Christ is referred to in the previous verse as “coming with the clouds,” the words of Revelation 1:8 and the surrounding verses show that he could not be “the Alpha and the Omega.” In the Scriptures, only the Father of the Lord Jesus Christ is spoken of as “the Lord God” and as the “Almighty.” Jesus Christ even refers to his Father as “my God.” (John 20:17; Rev. 3:12) According to Revelation 1:1, the revelation was given to Jesus Christ by God. Hence, we should expect the words of the Almighty God to be quoted in the account. The first reference to “the Alpha and the Omega” is manifestly an example of this. Moreover, in the very next verse, the writer of the book of Revelation, the apostle John, says: “I . . . came to be in the isle that is called Patmos for speaking about God and bearing witness to Jesus.” (Rev. 1:9) This provides additional confirmation that John understood God to be the Father of the Lord Jesus Christ.

In what sense is Jehovah God “the One who is and who was and who is to come”? Being the eternal God, Jehovah has at all times been the Almighty. (Ps. 90:2) So, in the indefinite past, he was the Most High. Furthermore, he continues to be the Almighty God and will come in that capacity to execute his judgment. As shown in other parts of the book of Revelation, Jehovah God will display his all-powerfulness at the time that his Son destroys all opposers of his sovereignty.​—Rev. 16:14; 19:13-16.

The next occurrence of the title “the Alpha and the Omega” is found at Revelation 21:6. In the following verse, the One who applies this title to himself says: “Anyone conquering will inherit these things, and I shall be his God and he will be my son.” Since Jesus Christ speaks of himself as a “brother” of these conquerors, it is the Father of the Lord Jesus Christ who is referring to himself as “the Alpha and the Omega.”​—Compare Matthew 25:40; Hebrews 2:10-12.

Finally, at Revelation 22:12, 13, we read: “Look! I am coming quickly, and the reward I give is with me, to render to each one as his work is. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end.” This quotation appears among others that are ascribed to an angel and to Jesus Christ. Before these words are quoted in the book of Revelation, the angel who was instrumental in presenting the revelation to the apostle John spoke. (Rev. 22:8, 9) Then, after the quotation that begins with Revelation 22:12 and ends with the words of verse 15, we find the statement: “I, Jesus, sent my angel.” (Rev. 22:16) Since the context does not necessitate our attributing the words of Revelation 22:12, 13 either to the angel or to Jesus, they could have originated with another speaker. Consistent with the rest of the book of Revelation, “the Alpha and the Omega” must be the Almighty God. He is the One who comes in the capacity of a judge to reward and to punish individuals according to their works.

The thought expressed at Revelation 22:12 also harmonizes with what the apostle Paul wrote. He stated: “According to your hardness and unrepentant heart you are storing up wrath for yourself on the day of wrath and of the revealing of God’s righteous judgment. And he will render to each one according to his works: everlasting life to those who are seeking glory and honor and incorruptibleness by endurance in work that is good; however, for those who are contentious and who disobey the truth but obey unrighteousness there will be wrath and anger, tribulation and distress, upon the soul of every man who works what is injurious, of the Jew first and also of the Greek; but glory and honor and peace for everyone who works what is good, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.” (Rom. 2:5-10) Of course, the judgment will be expressed by Jehovah God through his Son, for the apostle also says: “This will be in the day when God through Christ Jesus judges the secret things of mankind.”​—Rom. 2:16.

The fact that Jehovah God speaks of himself as “the Alpha and the Omega” gives us the assurance that what he has purposed will come to a successful realization. This should prompt us to do our utmost to be found approved by him. Our reward will then be certain, for the Bible tells us: “God is not unrighteous so as to forget your work and the love you showed for his name.”​—Heb. 6:10. WTS "Bible questions answered"

@sonship said
@divegeester
No significance points have I seen from you

Page one fourth post.

Anytime you feel up to it…

@divegeester said
Tell me / they / him / he …

How is Jesus in the highest place with the name that is above ALL names
Philippians 2:9

How, is in the same verse if you just read it - Philippians 2:9

"Therefore also God highly exalted Him and bestowed upon Him the name which is above every name." (Phil. 2:9, Recovery Version)

By God's exalting Him and God's bestowing upon Him does Jesus Christ have a name which is above every name.

the expression “the Alpha and the Omega” appears three times. Does this designation, as many believe, apply both to the Almighty God, Jehovah, and to his Son Jesus Christ?

Yes, the designation Alpha and Omega refers to the Triune God.
And it is confessed by Jesus Christ.

"Behold, I come quickly, and My reward is with Me to render to each one as his work is,
I am the Alpha and the Omega,
the First and the Last,
the Beginning and the End." (Rev. 22:12,13)

Compare to Matthew 16:27

"For the Son of Man is to come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and then He will repay each man according to his doings." (Matt. 16:27)

Jesus Christ is everything the saved need.
"All the fulness of the Godhead dwells in Him bodily and we are made full in Him (Col. 2:9,10)

"For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily, And you have been made full in Him"

From A to Z all things are supplied to the believers in this Christ.
From Alpha - Omega God has given to His elect everything they need in Christ.

"And He is before all things, and all things subsist in Him" (Col. 1:17)

So He who says "I am the First and the Last" also said "I am the Alpha and the Omega".

Outside of man all things subsist in Christ.
And inside of those whom He is saving He is and will be everything man needs.

"And He is the Head of the Body, the church; He is the beginning, the Firstborn from the dead . . . " (Col. 1:18)

Both in the old creation He is first. And in the new creation the church as the Firstborn Son from the dead He is the beginning, the First, the HEAD of the entity which is God dispensed INTO man.

" . . . that He might have the first place in all things." (v.18)

All the fulness was PLEASED to dwell in Him. With all the fulness is everything FOR man's salvation.

"For in Him all the fulness was pleased to dwell and through Him to reconcile all things to Himself, having made peace through the blood of His cross - through Him,
whether the things on the earth or the things in the heavens." (v.20)

Jesus Christ is Jehovah God incarnated who says as Jehovah of the Old Testament (Isa. 44:6;48:12) and in the New Testament in Christ that He is the First and the Last and the Beginning and the End (Rev. 1:18;22:13)

And Christ so bountifully everything man needs now supplies His redeemed as "the bountiful supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ" in whatever our circumstances, whatever our situation, whatever our trials and troubles.

'For I know that for me this will turn out to salvation through your petition and the bountiful supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ." (Phil. 1:19 Recovery Version)

In what sense is Jehovah God “the One who is and who was and who is to come”? Being the eternal God, Jehovah has at all times been the Almighty. (Ps. 90:2)

The Son comes for from days of eternity. His goings forth are from eternity showing before incarnation the Son has eternal pre-existence.

"(But you, O Bethlehem Ephrathah, so little among the thousands of Judah . . .
From you there will come forth to Me
He who is to be Ruler in Israel;
And His goings forth are from ancient times,
From the days of eternity) " (Micah 5:2 RcV)

@sonship said
How, is in the same verse if you just read it - Philippians 2:9

"Therefore also God highly exalted Him and bestowed upon Him the name which is above every name." (Phil. 2:9, Recovery Version)

By God's exalting Him and God's bestowing upon Him does Jesus Christ have a name which is above every name.

If you were going to respond to my post I thought you would have made an effort to address the content, explicitly and implicit, rather than play games with the semantics.

My post stands there then, unaddressed and pointing directly at your OP and without the need to spitefully call you a “fool” or accuse you of “scraping the bottom of the barrel”.

What an interesting study of the deeply entrenched religious mindset you are sonship.

@divegeester

How is Jesus in the highest place with the name that is above ALL names
Philippians 2:9

You asked how and I answered how. If I write more you're likely to call more writing "waffle".

If you have nothing specific to point out the incorrectness of my answer
padding your inability with other kinds of criticisms is irrelevant.

"Therefore also God highly exalted Him and bestowed upon Him the name which is above every name." (Phil. 2:9, Recovery Version)

God by His authority and power exalted Christ to the highest point.
God by His authority and power bestowed upon Christ the highest name.