14 Jun '15 12:40>
Originally posted by josephwI have heard some Christians claim that He was the archangel Michael.
Did Jesus Christ have a pre-incarnate existence? If you believe that, then who was Jesus before He was born a man?
Originally posted by josephwYou are simply making stuff up that is not explicitly stated in the verse, the verse does not say that Jesus is one is substance and nature, you simply made it up or rather the trinitarian that you're a sock puppet for made it up. why do you need to resort to extra Biblical terms to explain your stance? Shall I tell you what we all know? because your doctrine is also extra biblical.
The separate contexts are what is confounding you. To be one in spirit or of mind and purpose is one thing, but to be one in substance and nature is another.
The Jews understood Jesus to mean that He was equal to God by what He said because what Jesus said was that He and the Father were one. An accusation Jesus did not deny.
You're are in denial of that point.
Originally posted by josephwIf you are seeking the truth you would ignore what the Jews understood.
The separate contexts are what is confounding you. To be one in spirit or of mind and purpose is one thing, but to be one in substance and nature is another.
The Jews understood Jesus to mean that He was equal to God by what He said because what Jesus said was that He and the Father were one. An accusation Jesus did not deny.
You're are in denial of that point.
Originally posted by josephwJesus Christ was the Son of God and was with God prior to his arrival on earth as the son of Mary.
So you say, but you don't even know who Christ is.
Did Jesus Christ have a pre-incarnate existence? If you believe that, then who was Jesus before He was born a man?
Originally posted by robbie carrobieObviously God is one is not referring to the number one, but a unity, as in the Triune God. The Son being able to do what He sees the Father do, indicated He is equally God with the Father.
That is simply another lie, Jesus did not say that he was equal to God, his enemies claimed it, not Jesus, those very same enemies whose charge against Christ you would now have us believe.
I see you are still parroting these old trinitarian falsehoods, I would be pleased if you will explain the following,
at John 17:21, 22, Jesus prayed reg ...[text shortened]... us believe?
I have no problem listening to Jesus, its his enemies that I have a problem with.
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieDon't be so shallow! We all use the same words in different context to mean different things.
Its not a different context nor is it a different word and I dont have the problem, you do. Jesus uses the exact same word in exactly the same manner, you will now tell us why its use is any different and you will now tell us if the disciples are also equal to God and part of the trinity, they being one with Jesus and God. If you will not or cannot ...[text shortened]... te that I have not addressed the question are rather plastic, transparent, tedious and pathetic.
Originally posted by FMFYou've heard Jehovah's Witnesses make that claim, and others that don't know what they're talking about either. But that's not what God says.
I have heard some Christians claim that He was the archangel Michael.
Originally posted by josephwI believe Jesus i just don't believe you or your friends the Pharisees upon whose testimony you base your faith. Not only that you cannot tell us why the disciples are also not part of the trinity and equal to God following your logic and reasoning. Quite frankly i don't know why anyone should believe a word you say.
Don't be so shallow! We all use the same words in different context to mean different things.
You're simply out of context with your interpretations, especially when it comes to the identity of Christ.
And you still can't seem to bring yourself to reply to the issue I have repeatedly mentioned concerning why Jesus said exactly what He knew the Jews wo ...[text shortened]... u insist on believing Jesus isn't what the hundreds of verses throughout scripture say He is! 🙄
Originally posted by robbie carrobieI'm not asking you to believe me. I don't believe you, why should I expect you to believe me?
I believe Jesus i just don't believe you or your friends the Pharisees upon whose testimony you base your faith. Not only that you cannot tell us why the disciples are also not part of the trinity and equal to God following your logic and reasoning. Quite frankly i don't know why anyone should believe a word you say.
Originally posted by josephwYou are asking me to believe you, you are trying to tell me without the slightest evidence that my understanding of the verses is incorrect, I don't believe you and I don't believe Jesus enemies either. There is not the slightest evidence that they understood what Jesus meant and I have proven that they were mistaken with regard to Jesus breaking the sabbath of which they also accused him. You have provided nothing but your opinion which I don't believe.
I'm not asking you to believe me. I don't believe you, why should I expect you to believe me?
I believe God. So should you! So should everybody!
But you're still not perceiving the verses in question correctly.
The Jews accused Jesus of making Himself equal with God based on Jesus' own testimony about Himself. Jesus said what He knew the Jews wou ...[text shortened]... false is to say Jesus made an error in His speech!
Like I said before, you need to see that.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieI already told you I don't expect you to believe me, and unless you're going to call me a liar outright just take my word for it.
You are asking me to believe you, you are trying to tell me without the slightest evidence that my understanding of the verses is incorrect, I don't believe you and I don't believe Jesus enemies either. There is not the slightest evidence that they understood what Jesus meant and I have proven that they were mistaken with regard to Jesus breaking the ...[text shortened]... f which they also accused him. You have provided nothing but your opinion which I don't believe.