Does one need to believe in Jesus for salvation.

@divegeester said
Separately I’d like to again state...

There is no such place or thing as hell in my opinion. (if you had been more present in this forum over the years you would have read the dozens of threads on this).

Now, again, if someone is truly and diligently seeking God, but they don't know Jesus yet, are they still saved at that time?
This is my question to you and others here; and, no one here has clearly answered this simple question.
I clearly know no one is saved except by Jesus; I'm asking about someone who is truly seeking God but does not know Jesus yet.
Does God's mercy, love, and forgiveness, still cover them and save them?
Can you or anyone else here tell me that this person is not saved because they do not know Jesus yet? Even tho they're diligently seeking God?
Scriptures please?
Simple really.
Anyone?

@divegeester said
Separately I’d like to again state...

There is no such place or thing as hell in my opinion. (if you had been more present in this forum over the years you would have read the dozens of threads on this).

So you do not believe Gods Word?

@divegeester said
There are no scriptures to support this position, as has been pointed out.

However, we are saved in eternity, we are therefore predestined to be saved. God knows us before we were born. But for us to be certain of our own salvation we have to come to Christ, then WE can “work out our salvation” as the scripture says.

Try not to confuse our eternity state with our t ...[text shortened]... ink is what you are doing.

Nevertheless the bottom line is that a belief in Christ is necessary.

A Calvinist.
I'd love to have a conversation on predestination with you.
You do know that Calvin was a serial murderer and all in the name of Christ do you not?
He murdered at least a dozen people.

@kingdavid403 said
A Calvinist.
I'd love to have a conversation on predestination with you.
You do know that Calvin was a serial murderer and all in the name of Christ do you not?
He murdered at least a dozen people.

What does this say about Calvinism?

@kingdavid403 said
You do know that Calvin was a serial murderer and all in the name of Christ do you not?He murdered at least a dozen people.

Hitler was a Christian; what’s your point?

@kingdavid403 said
You say no, and you can have your own opinion, but your opinion contradicts the Word of God.
Actually, my opinion does NOT contradict the Word of God at all according to what I'm asking. You can see what I'm asking in my previous post.

[b]Acts 4:12
Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we ...[text shortened]... God (conception). I'm not asking anything more than this at this time; and, I'm not asking any-less.

"If one is truly and diligently seeking after God, even if they do not know Jesus yet, they are SAVED (salvation) at the moment they started truly and diligently seeking God (conception)."

Is that a question? Or are you saying (hypothetically) that one is saved before they are "born again" on the basis that they are "diligently seeking" God?

Is that what you're saying? Because if you are, and if you are a "born again" Bible believing Christian, then you had better provide scriptural references to support that claim.

I'm not taking YOUR word for it. Come on KingDavid, don't turn into one of those nutty Christians. Give me a break! Quit dancing around this thread making redundant claims and assertions without biblical support for them.

I read nowhere in the scriptures that one is saved on the basis of "diligently seeking God". It's not there!

@secondson said

"If one is truly and diligently seeking after God, even if they do not know Jesus yet, they are SAVED (salvation) at the moment they started truly and diligently seeking God (conception)."

Is that a question? Or are you saying (hypothetically) that one is saved before they are "born again" on the basis that they are "diligently seeking" God?

Is that wha ...[text shortened]... owhere in the scriptures that one is saved on the basis of "diligently seeking God". It's not there!

All excellent points. I'll get back to you soon in the next day or so. Also, I firmly believe that all opponents of this debate have also danced around this question. Either way, good points and I'll be back. 🙂

@fmf said
What does this say about Calvinism?

Truth is truth; and, facts are facts; whether we like them or not.
I'm not saying that every Calvinist Christian is a serial murderer; and, I'm not saying that they are not true Christians.

@kingdavid403 said
Truth is truth; and, facts are facts; whether we like them or not.
I'm not saying that every Calvinist Christian is a serial murderer; or that they are not true Christians.

Uh, yeah, ok. But, what does what you said about Calvin (all of a sudden) say, to your way of thinking, about Calvinism?

@fmf said
Uh, yeah, ok. But, what does what you said about Calvin (all of a sudden) say, to your way of thinking, about Calvinism?

Truth is truth; and, facts are facts; whether we like them or not.
It does not matter what I think. I'm still here.
Anything else you can come up with in an attempt to be a disruptive troll?

@kingdavid403 said
Truth is truth; and, facts are facts; whether we like them or not.
It does not matter what I think. I'm still here.
Anything else you can come up with in an attempt to be a disruptive troll?

Do you not have any thoughts on Calvinism? You suddenly mentioned it as if you had something to say. "Truth is truth; and, facts are facts; whether we like them or not. It does not matter what I think. I'm still here"... is all you have to offer on Calvinism?

@fmf said
Do you not have any thoughts on Calvinism? You suddenly mentioned it as if you had something to say. "Truth is truth; and, facts are facts; whether we like them or not. It does not matter what I think. I'm still here"... is all you have to offer on Calvinism?

Do you not have any thoughts on Calvinism?
I've been to several Calvinist worship services in my lifetime.
In person, I have always found Calvinist Christians to be good, friendly, and upstanding Christians.
I never knew many of them close tho. Some kind of; but mostly no.
I have never had a problem with any of them; until now.
Personally, I do not much believe in Calvin's predestination theory.
The Calvinist's base their whole salvation on it; however, this could be said about anyone's beliefs on salvation.
I just can't swallow the theory; and, the Calvinists hold it in high regard.
I'm certain MY opinions on Calvin are fairly evident to you. However, those are just my opinions. Nothing more.
Different time; different culture.
There was several others around at that time that were just like him also. Did same things.

@kingdavid403 said
you have rejected both for various convoluted and Hebrew/OT prophet existential reasons none of which address the core premise of what is stated in those scriptures.
I have not rejected anything.

Oh sorry.... then you agree that agree that a belief in Jesus is necessary for salvation after all?


Just bringing you back to this point which you dodged earlier KingDavid403

@divegeester said
Oh sorry.... then you agree that agree that a belief in Jesus is necessary for salvation after all?


Just bringing you back to this point which you dodged earlier KingDavid403

I've already said that I will be back in a day or so with my full position on this subject.
I have other things that need tending also.
I'll be back fairly soon. 🙂
See ya then. 😉

@kingdavid403 said
I've already said that I will be back in a day or so with my full position on this subject.
I have other things that need tending too also.
I'll be back. 🙂

Oh ok, sorry I missed you saying that.

Good back and forth so far.