Originally posted by FetchmyjunkAs i have already said (to you), I have no reason to believe there is "salvation" or an "afterlife". I am interested in how and why people argue that these things do exist. I don't think God has revealed Himself to any of us, but I find it interesting to talk to people who think He has.
So do you have your own opinion about salvation that you are willing to defend or do you just enjoy belittling and making fun of other people's beliefs? Also why are you genuinely interested in something that you claim doesn't exist? It's like an atheist claiming to be genuinely interested in God, but when challenged about something they have said they just hide behind their atheism and claim they have no beliefs.
Your puzzlement at my interest in spiritual matters is not as compelling a 'point' as you may think it is in the context of the interesting conversation we have been having.
If you have had - as it sometimes seems - little or no interaction with non-Christians who are interested in engaging you about the matters of belief and disbelief and lack of belief, then you should consider embracing the opportunity this forum provides.
21 Aug 16
Originally posted by FMFDo you think people who believe in salvation and an afterlife are stupid, ignorant or less intelligent than you are?
As i have already said (to you), I have no reason to believe there is "salvation" or an "afterlife". I am interested in how and why people argue that these things do exist. I don't think God has revealed Himself to any of us, but I find it interesting to talk to people who think He has.
Your puzzlement at my interest in spiritual matters is not as compelling ...[text shortened]... lief and lack of belief, then you should consider embracing the opportunity this forum provides.
Do you take pleasure in making fun of people who do not share your beliefs?
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21 Aug 16
Originally posted by FetchmyjunkFMF just stated, 'I am genuinely interested in what Christians claim about the afterlife and what they claim are the requirements of salvation. I am not pretending to care.'
Do you think people who believe in salvation and an afterlife are stupid, ignorant or less intelligent than you are?
Do you take pleasure in making fun of people who do not share your beliefs?
Do you think he would have said this if he thought 'people who believe in salvation and an afterlife are stupid?'
Originally posted by FetchmyjunkI don't make fun of people who don't share my beliefs. I question them. I offer observations. I confront them when i don't think they are making sense. I point out contradictions or inconsistencies when i think I encounter them. I am forthright in my dissent and disagreement and I'm happy to explain why. But i don't make fun of people for their beliefs.
Do you think people who believe in salvation and an afterlife are stupid, ignorant or less intelligent than you are?
Do you take pleasure in making fun of people who do not share your beliefs?
Nor am i a racist. Or a sexist. I don't make fun of people's appearance or of their sexual orientation. I don't make fun of people's age or people with physical disabilities. So, in a similar vein, I don't make fun of people's religion or beliefs.
21 Aug 16
Originally posted by FMFThanks for clearing that up. On a side note, do you think it is fair to challenge other people's beliefs if you cannot offer them a better alternative? For example you ridicule the Bible as a source of revelation but you base your beliefs only on a gut feeling. How is that any better from your point of view?
I don't make fun of people who don't share my beliefs. I question them. I offer observations. I confront them when i don't think they are making sense. I point out contradictions or inconsistencies when i think I encounter them. I am forthright in my dissent and disagreement and I'm happy to explain why. But i don't make fun of people for their beliefs.
Nor ...[text shortened]... physical disabilities. So, in a similar vein, I don't make fun of people's religion or beliefs.
21 Aug 16
Originally posted by FetchmyjunkNo, I don't think it's "unfair" to challenge someone's beliefs and more especially not on a forum dedicated to debate and discussion of beliefs. I don't think there is any onus on me to try to replace your beliefs with my own. I don't "ridicule" the Bible.
Thanks for clearing that up. On a side note, do you think it is fair to challenge other people's beliefs if you cannot offer them a better alternative? For example you ridicule the Bible as a source of revelation but you base your beliefs only on a gut feeling. How is that any better from your point of view?
Originally posted by FMFSo your sole aim is simply to cause other people to lack belief in the same things that you lack belief in? Isn't that like the blind trying to lead those that can see?
No, I don't think it's "unfair" to challenge someone's beliefs and more especially not on a forum dedicated to debate and discussion of beliefs. I don't think there is any onus on me to try to replace your beliefs with my own. I don't "ridicule" the Bible.
21 Aug 16
Originally posted by FetchmyjunkMy sole aim (here) is to talk about spiritual matters with people who have different beliefs. The only thing I might be said to want to "cause" in others is discussion and debate. I don't think either of us is "blind".
So your sole aim is simply to cause other people to lack belief in the same things that you lack belief in? Isn't that like the blind trying to lead those that can see?
Originally posted by FMFOk thanks for clearing that up. If you don't mind me asking when you were a Christian, what did you perceive to be "The gospel of Jesus Christ"?
My sole aim (here) is to talk about spiritual matters with people who have different beliefs. The only thing I might be said to want to "cause" in others is discussion and debate. I don't think either of us is "blind".
Originally posted by FMFWhich denomination of Christianity did you subscribe to when you were a Christian?
I don't know what you're trying to ask me about.
I am surprised that you don't know what I am trying to ask you. It seems there are many Christians today who claim to be Christians but have no idea what Christianty is all about.
Originally posted by FetchmyjunkI was a Catholic. I don't care in the slightest if you think I had "no idea what Christianity was all about" back then. Nothing could more remote or irrelevant to me today than your estimation or endorsement/denunciation of what I did or did not believe a decade or two decades or three decades ago.
Which denomination of Christianity did you subscribe to when you were a Christian?
I am surprised that you don't know what I am trying to ask you. It seems there are many Christians today who claim to be Christians but have no idea what Christianty is all about.
Several posters here - sonship, Suzianne, robbie carrobie, KellyJay and a few others - have claimed I am flat out lying about my Christian past. It matters not one whit to me.
Originally posted by FMFWould you ever entertain the slightest possibility that maybe what you used to believe was not the genuine article of Christianty in its purest form?
I was a Catholic. I don't care in the slightest if you think I had "no idea what Christianity was all about" back then. Nothing could more remote or irrelevant to me today than your estimation or endorsement/denunciation of what I did or did not believe a decade or two decades or three decades ago.
Several posters here - sonship, Suzianne, robbie carrobie, ...[text shortened]... thers - have claimed I am flat out lying about my Christian past. It matters not one whit to me.
21 Aug 16
Originally posted by FetchmyjunkI don't care in the slightest what you think of what i believed in the 1980s and 1990s. It is of absolutely no interest to me. It felt genuine to me at the time. Speculating about whether it complies with what you happen think is "genuine" or "pure" is of no concern to me. I am not trying to promote it or convince anyone of its merits or authenticity.
Would you ever entertain the slightest possibility that maybe what you used to believe was not the genuine article of Christianty in its purest form?
22 Aug 16
Originally posted by FMFI am not speculating, I am asking you if you would ever entertain the thought that maybe the form of Christianity that you had was not genuine? When you say it felt genuine at the time you are not answering my question are you?
I don't care in the slightest what you think of what i believed in the 1980s and 1990s. It is of absolutely no interest to me. It felt genuine to me at the time. Speculating about whether it complies with what you happen think is "genuine" or "pure" is of no concern to me. I am not trying to promote it or convince anyone of its merits or authenticity.