Originally posted by PhlabibitI did read the web page, of course. I read everything I present. I simply won't address people like n01 who have no interest in learning, but only in being difficult.
I don't stand by No.1's forum etiquette by any means, but if you throw info like that out into the forums, I feel you should give shreds of evidence beyond posting web pages to read.
You might even go as far as to read the web page yourself, and make up your own mind and words on the subject. Once you make up your mind, be able to prove it if you mus ...[text shortened]... hat, I feel you are making bold claims with no proof, and trying to pass them off as facts.
P
However, if you or anyone else has questions, I'll be happy to address them.
Originally posted by AThousandYoungTrashing the RCC is one of the ways the evangelicals go about selling their personality cults.
Claiming that the Catholic Church was predicted as one of the kingdoms/empires is a serious stretch, Darfius. If you can make a stretch like that, then this prophecy could indeed have been applied almost no matter how things turned out. This is not scientificly rigorous prediction. It's closer to astrology or fortune telling - vague statements tha ...[text shortened]... t, how it's sponsored by the EU, and exactly how it said what you claim it said in a paragraph?
They trash other churches too.
It is interesting to note that the "Fifth Monarchy Men" used the Book of Daniel to predict the second coming of Jesus and the Fifth Kingdom. This was three hundred and fifty years ago. It was predicted by one popular Fifth Monarchist that the Jews would be converted in 1650 and the Second Coming would be in 1700.
http://www.exlibris.org/nonconform/engdis/fifthmonarchists.html
Originally posted by AThousandYoungWhy is that interesting? They clearly didn't read the WHOLE Bible and the part where it says "And no man shall know the hour, not the angels in heaven, nay not even the Son of God: but only the Father which is in Heaven."
It is interesting to note that the "Fifth Monarchy Men" used the Book of Daniel to predict the second coming of Jesus and the Fifth Kingdom. This was three hundred and fifty years ago. It was predicted by one popular Fifth Monarchist that the Jews would be converted in 1650 and the Second Coming would be in 1700.
http://www.exlibris.org/nonconform/engdis/fifthmonarchists.html
Originally posted by DarfiusBut might they know the day, but not the hour?
Why is that interesting? They clearly didn't read the WHOLE Bible and the part where it says "And no man shall know the hour, not the angels in heaven, nay not even the Son of God: but only the Father which is in Heaven."
Originally posted by Pawnokeyhole"But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober. For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night. But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ, Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him. Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do." 1st Thessalonians 5:1-11
Could they know the week, month, or year?
However, Jesus tells us to watch the signs of the times, which are detailed in Paul's letters, Revelations, and Daniel.
"The Pharisees also with the Sadducees came, and tempting desired him that he would shew them a sign from heaven. He answered and said unto them, When it is evening, ye say, It will be fair weather: for the sky is red. And in the morning, It will be foul weather to day: for the sky is red and lowring. O ye hypocrites, ye can discern the face of the sky; but can ye not discern the signs of the times? A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas. And he left them, and departed. And when his disciples were come to the other side, they had forgotten to take bread." Matthew 16:1-5
EDIT: In answer to your question, we can know the season of our Lord's coming, not the actual season as in Fall, Summer, etc, but the general time, which is why I always mention Israel's rebirth in 1948.
Also, see where it says Peace and Safety? What is most of the world focused on right now? Peace between Israel and Palestine.
Originally posted by DarfiusWhile you talking prophesy , show me the prophecy that predicts that shortly after the coming of the Messiah , the Romans will demolish the Temple and break up Judah. Isn't that the opposite of what was prophesied ?
"But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. For yourselves know perfectly that [b]the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. But ye, breth ...[text shortened]... y? What is most of the world focused on right now? Peace between Israel and Palestine.
[/b]
Exodus :
20:21 And the people stood afar off, and Moses drew near unto the
thick darkness where God was.
Originally posted by frogstompUhh...after the Messiah came the first time, the Romans DID destroy the temple (70 AD) and DID scatter the Jews.
While you talking prophesy , show me the prophecy that predicts that shortly after the coming of the Messiah , the Romans will demolish the Temple and break up Judah. Isn't that the opposite of what was prophesied ?
Exodus :
20:21 And the people stood afar off, and Moses drew near unto the
thick darkness where God was.
The verses I showed are speaking of Jesus' 2nd coming, and of the end of the age of man.
In answer to your query:
"Yea, whiles I was speaking in prayer, even the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, touched me about the time of the evening oblation. And he informed me, and talked with me, and said, O Daniel, I am now come forth to give thee skill and understanding. At the beginning of thy supplications the commandment came forth, and I am come to shew thee; for thou art greatly beloved: therefore understand the matter, and consider the vision. Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy. Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times. And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate." Daniel 9:21-27
"Weeks" are periods of 7 years. Look it up in history for when there was a decree for the Jews to rebuild the Temple and look when Jesus was killed.
Man...Daniel sure did make a lot of "lucky guesses", eh?
Originally posted by DarfiusDuh...since the prophesy the first wasnt accurate. takes a bit of confidence out of the prophesy the second.. since the first may or may not have happened yet according to the prophesy.
Uhh...after the Messiah came the first time, the Romans DID destroy the temple (70 AD) and DID scatter the Jews.
The verses I showed are speaking of Jesus' 2nd coming, and of the end of the age of man.
Remember the context of this thread is prophesy as evidence for christianity.
It would seem like the prophesy of the Messiah would be the most important. If that fails , the idea of biblical prophesy fsils along with it, at least for Christians , it would have to.
Originally posted by DarfiusDaniel predicted weeks are years.???.
In answer to your query:
"Yea, whiles I was speaking in prayer, even the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, touched me about the time of the evening oblation. And he informed me, and talked with me, and said, O Daniel, I am now come forth to give thee skill and understanding. At the beginning of th ...[text shortened]... look when Jesus was killed.
Man...Daniel sure did make a lot of "lucky guesses", eh?
The Messiah was to rebuild the temple, period.
and DUH!!!! before Christ it stood fine,,, after him it was gone.
so far i've seen you post ,, witties like
the sumerians didnt know their own names. now Daniel dont know the difference between a week and a year.
BTW DaniEL means ,,, EL is my judge..
EL the bull god of the israELites they named god after.
Daniel 4 has some prophecy. I don't know if there are any non-Biblical sources to verify that King Neb went insane as described, so whether this one actually came true or not is not certain, and there's no experiment that could be done to verify it.
In addition, if it did take place, then basically what happened was King Neb had a dream which Daniel interpreted as a harbringer of the King's insanity. It's possible that Daniel knew what the King's own symbols meant to the King as he'd been Neb's mystical advisor for a while. Or, he may have seen the signs of madness and chosen to interpret the dream to give this result. The form the madness took and the duration may have been shaped by Daniel's predictions.
This is not convincing as an example of scientific prediction to me.