05 Mar 10
Originally posted by twhiteheadOne of the purposes of religion is to keep the masses in order. Read some of the accounts of the Christian Romans interaction with the Pagan tribes.
So why do you suggest inventing a religion to achieve that aim? And why do you suggest that it is somehow religions job to achieve that aim for you?
[b]The phrase "getting back to the garden" has nothing to do with the mythological garden of eden. It is a phrase used back in the 60's.
I see. I had never heard it before. Which country does it come from and whats its origin?[/b]
Getting back to the garden is US in origin from a song by Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young I believe.
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05 Mar 10
Originally posted by caissad4Except that Christians believe that human nature has been perverted by sin and therefore must continually strive in faith and grace to perform acts of charity. The failure to create a charitable, perfect society only confirms what Christians have always believed.
In theory, yes. But over 2000 years and the progress Christianity has failed to achieve indicates a failure.
05 Mar 10
1 edit
Originally posted by caissad4Religions have purposes? Who decides what those are?
One of the purposes of religion is to keep the masses in order.
Read some of the accounts of the Christian Romans interaction with the Pagan tribes.
So religions have been used for specific purposes. Of that there can be no doubt. But that is not the same thing at all.
I may climb a tree, I may chop it down and make paper out of it, I may feed it to my goats, but what is a trees purpose, and should I demand that it fit its purpose?
Getting back to the garden is US in origin from a song by Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young I believe.
I looked up the lyrics and I rather suspect it is a reference to the Garden of eden. Do you have an alternative hypothesis?
05 Mar 10
3 edits
Originally posted by caissad4You ever hear of Milton and book called "Paradise Lost"?
One of the purposes of religion is to keep the masses in order. Read some of the accounts of the Christian Romans interaction with the Pagan tribes.
Getting back to the garden is US in origin from a song by Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young I believe.
I'm not recommending it. I am just asking if you heard of it.
You don't seriously think the US's Crosby, Stills, and Nash were the first artists to refer to returning to Paradise, do you?
05 Mar 10
Originally posted by jaywillThe opening post says :
I agree. That God is depicted with a spouse is a repeated theme in the Bible.
- the Watchtower Society is Gods wifely organisation.
- that if you are to walk in light and truth you must render respect and obedience to the Watchtower Society.
- that the Watchtower Society (no other) is the mother of all those dedicated to God.
Do you agree that those three claims are correct?
05 Mar 10
Originally posted by Rajk999Lets put it this way, if I were a theif on a cross dying next to Christ and I placed my faith in him I don't need your little formula for salvation.
Well you probably cant see it but you are putting the cart before the horse.
You have a chance at salvation after you demonstrate love.
I see it as :
First faith and belief in Christ
Then love and good works
Then salvation when Christ returns
You and the OSAS group says:
First faith and belief in Christ
Then salvation which you cannot lose regardless of your actions.
Then love and good works .. maybe, its optional.
05 Mar 10
Originally posted by whodeyPicking and choosing who you want to be ? You happy with that ? Fine.
Lets put it this way, if I were a theif on a cross dying next to Christ and I placed my faith in him I don't need your little formula for salvation.
If you were a thief .... Yes.
What if you are .... a certain ruler .... , Good Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?
Luk 18:19 And Jesus said unto him, ...Luk 18:20 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother.
Luk 18:21 And he said, All these have I kept from my youth up.
Luk 18:22 Now when Jesus heard these things, he said unto him, Yet lackest thou one thing: sell all that thou hast, and distribute unto the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, follow me...
In fact why pick one or the other. Why not simply do as Christ commanded. Its simple, believe in Him and do good works.
05 Mar 10
1 edit
Originally posted by Rajk999this shows just how much a tube you really are, where does it state that the watchtower society is Gods wifely organisation? nowhere, for the watchtower society is simply a legal entity. Get it, Gods 'wife like', organisation is not the watchtower society as you have erroneously tried to assert, but because you dont know what it really is, because of your ignorance, you assume to tell lies to others about Jehovahs witnesses and their beliefs, now unless the watchtower society is registered with God in heaven as a legal entity, you have some explaining to do, for that's all it is, a legal entity enabling the distribution of Bible literature. you will note the full title, watchtower and bible tract society, Pennsylvania, incorporated. Now does God need bible tracts in heaven? Perhaps he is in need of Bibles? Perhaps he needs to register his printing presses in heaven? Why people bother reading your apostate mince i dont know. First we are gods, infallible and now we are a registered charity in heaven, get a grip.
The opening post says :
- the Watchtower Society is Gods wifely organisation.
- that if you are to walk in light and truth you must render respect and obedience to the Watchtower Society.
- that the Watchtower Society (no other) is the mother of all those dedicated to God.
Do you agree that those three claims are correct?
05 Mar 10
1957; Watchtower, May 1, p. 274
"If we are to walk in the light of truth we must recognize not only Jehovah God as our Father but his organization as our mother. Today, also, God requires and exacts from his children obedience honor and respect. These must be rendered not only to the living God himself, but to his wifely organization as we.
My only question is the "Organization"being referred to here is what? Is it referring to God's universal church? Or the Watch Tower? The context of this is referring to Jehovah's organization right? Which is?
Manny "The Apostate"
05 Mar 10
Originally posted by menace71I don't believe it says the "Watchtower Bible and Tract Society" does it? It uses the word "organization". The word organization is refering to something organized by God you think? But is it so unbelieveable for you or Rajj to think that something on earth could not be referred to as a "Wife" or "Mother" from God's viewpoint?
1957; Watchtower, May 1, p. 274
"If we are to walk in the light of truth we must recognize not only Jehovah God as our Father but his organization as our mother. Today, also, God requires and exacts from his children obedience honor and respect. These must be rendered not only to the living God himself, but to his wifely organization as we. ...[text shortened]... of this is referring to Jehovah's organization right? Which is?
Manny "The Apostate"
Ga 4:6,7,26. Eph 5:23,25. Rev 19:7 & 21:2,9.
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06 Mar 10
Originally posted by galveston75Well, organisation is not the word used in Scripture. In the Scriptures, Israel, the nation and people, are the bride of God. The Church is the bride of Christ. 'Organisation' is rather a mundane, and modern, word. I do agree with you, however, that God does have a wife -- the people of God.
I don't believe it says the "Watchtower Bible and Tract Society" does it? It uses the word "organization". The word organization is refering to something organized by God you think? But is it so unbelieveable for you or Rajj to think that something on earth could not be referred to as a "Wife" or "Mother" from God's viewpoint?
Ga 4:6,7,26. Eph 5:23,25. Rev 19:7 & 21:2,9.
06 Mar 10
Originally posted by Conrau KYou all do know that it's not a literal wife right? It just explains how the affection would be as a husband would have for his wife. Many examples are used in the Bible such as this so we have something to relate and understand with.
Well, organisation is not the word used in Scripture. In the Scriptures, Israel, the nation and people, are the bride of God. The Church is the bride of Christ. 'Organisation' is rather a mundane, and modern, word. I do agree with you, however, that God does have a wife -- the people of God.
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06 Mar 10
Originally posted by galveston75I quite understand that. Scripture also presents God as a father (this is how Jesus instructs us to pray to him). If we interpreted this literally, then our relationship with God would be incestuous. All I am saying is that 'organisation' is not a Scriptural word (and according to your previous statements concerning biblical authority, it should not be used.)
You all do know that it's not a literal wife right? It just explains how the affection would be as a husband would have for his wife. Many examples are used in the Bible such as this so we have something to relate and understand with.