A hellish responsibility

Originally posted by KellyJay
Someone with a reprobate mind will not be deterred, God has turned them over to do what is not good. The only ones that it will deter will be those with the fear of God in them, the rest can mock God, there is no fear of God in them, their works will reveal what manner of people they are, as their words will too.

This screed does not address the questions.

Originally posted by KellyJay
The only ones that it will deter will be those with the fear of God in them...

You claim to have "the fear of God" in you. What are you therefore deterred from doing by the threat that those who don't believe in God are going to be tortured for eternity?

Originally posted by FMF
The questions you are so artlessly dodging are:

[1] What is the deterrent effect of the threat of some sort of grotesque and incomprehensible supernatural vengeance in the mind of someone who sincerely finds it far-fetched and incredible?

[2] If it is has no deterrent effect, then what is the point? And then, if it had no deterrent effect during a non-be ...[text shortened]... rrent - not for people, like me, who think it is far-fetched, morally incomprehensible nonsense.

The question you have so artlessly dodged: If hell is not real why do you sound so worried about it?

Originally posted by dj2becker
The question you have so artlessly dodged: If hell is not real why do you sound so worried about it?

I am not "worried" about anything. I am asking a question about the 'logic' of deterrence.

For the threat of eternal torture to be a credible deterrent, it would have to be perceived as real. Otherwise, the notion that the threat acts as a deterrent is just nonsense.

And even if the threat were real but failed to act as a deterrent to those who simply found it to be unbelievable, what would be the moral purpose of torturing the people who hadn't believed during their lives, if the people who were still alive, and who didn't believe it either, were unaware of the torture supposedly being administered to their predecessors?

Once again, the notion that the threat acts as a deterrent to non-believers is just nonsense.

Unless you are willing to explain rather than dodge?

Originally posted by FMF
I am not "worried" about anything. I am asking a question about the 'logic' of deterrence.

For the threat of eternal torture to be a credible deterrent, it would have to be perceived as real. Otherwise, the notion that the threat acts as a deterrent is just nonsense.

And even if the threat were real but failed to act as a deterrent to those who simply fo ...[text shortened]... rrent to non-believers is just nonsense.

Unless you are willing to explain rather than dodge?

If you are not worried about hell why do you spend so much time discussing something that you don't believe to be real? And if you are sure that it's not real what's the point of this discussion?

Originally posted by dj2becker
If you are not worried about hell why do you spend so much time discussing something that you don't believe to be real? And if you are sure that it's not real what's the point of this discussion?

This is a debate and discussion forum. I am asking a question about whether the notion of supernatural deterrence can be explained coherently. It's pretty clear that you, for one, are not even going to try.

Originally posted by dj2becker
What if it is a deterrent to those who do believe it's real, isn't that good enough for you?

Don't you think that if the threat of being burned alive for all eternity by some monstrous supernatural being was real and credible, that people would be flocking in billions to kiss its supernatural ass in order to avoid it?

The whole concept is a vile mixture of the ludicrous, the abominable and the incoherent. Never mind it being completely out of context of the love of God and the ministry of Jesus.

Don't you think that if the threat of being burned alive for all eternity by some monstrous supernatural being was real and credible, that people would be flocking in billions to kiss its supernatural ass in order to avoid it?

This is how Divegeester thinks of divine judgment of paying the penalty of eternal destruction (2 Thess. 1:9) .

"Rendering vengeance to those who do not know God and to those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ.

They will pay the penalty of eternal destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His strength."

, that people would be flocking in billions to kiss its supernatural ass in order to avoid it?

So if you turn out to be wrong in your interpretation of certain words of Jesus, will you request to join the condemned ?

Will you elect not to "kiss the supernatural ass" of One to Whom every knee will bow and every tongue openly confess ?

Will you elect that you would rather share eternal perdition than to serve such a Lord and Savior God ?

Dodge.

Originally posted by sonship
So if you turn out to be wrong in your interpretation of certain words of Jesus, will you request to join the judged ?

Will you elect not to "kiss the supernatural ass" of One to Whom every knee will bow and every tongue openly confess ?

Will you elect that you would rather share eternal perdition than to serve such a Lord and Savior God ?

Do you ever worry that you might sound like a baddie in Star Trek?

Originally posted by FMF
Do you ever worry that you might sound like a baddie in Star Trek?

I don't worry about your approval.

Originally posted by sonship
I don't worry about your approval.

Be that as it may, but it is pretty clear you seek the approval of the sort of people here who think "I don't worry about your approval" is a zinger.

Originally posted by FMF
I am not "worried" about anything. I am asking a question about the 'logic' of deterrence.

For the threat of eternal torture to be a credible deterrent, it would have to be perceived as real. Otherwise, the notion that the threat acts as a deterrent is just nonsense.

And even if the threat were real but failed to act as a deterrent to those who simply fo ...[text shortened]... rrent to non-believers is just nonsense.

Unless you are willing to explain rather than dodge?

Apart from whether or not hell was created as a deterrence, what logical objections do you have with a God who is the creator of life, making the rules that govern life (if those rules were to include heaven and hell)?

Originally posted by dj2becker
Apart from whether or not hell was created as a deterrence...

You mean "apart from..." what I am trying to discuss which you are steadfastly trying to dodge?

Originally posted by dj2becker
...what logical objections do you have with a God who is the creator of life, making the rules that govern life (if those rules were to include heaven and hell)?

We discussed this topic before. Why are you asking me about it again?