How maximize death rate...

@eladar said
Well almost all governors followed the CDC instructions and some who did were a bit more struct than others.

They are the ruling class and the people who pay to get them in position of power.

The CDC has issued advice on reopening for specific types of businesses. But guidelines for social distancing and working from home and closing restaurants nationwide came from the white house. The governors who imposed stricter 'stay at home' directives were, for the most part, dealing with bigger outbreaks and denser populations. These recommendations were based on the data available at the time. The ruling class is not trying to maximize the death rate. That would be weird and unnecessary.

@wildgrass said
The CDC has issued advice on reopening for specific types of businesses. But guidelines for social distancing and working from home and closing restaurants nationwide came from the white house. The governors who imposed stricter 'stay at home' directives were, for the most part, dealing with bigger outbreaks and denser populations. These recommendations were based on the da ...[text shortened]... ime. The ruling class is not trying to maximize the death rate. That would be weird and unnecessary.

So you think Trump came up with the guidelines or did he simply rubber stamp them?

@eladar said
So you think Trump came up with the guidelines or did he simply rubber stamp them?

Given their impact, I'd hope neither.

@wildgrass said
Given their impact, I'd hope neither.

If they came through the white house, he had to approve it.

When it comes to this covid thing, most of the stuff was rubber stamped.

@eladar said
If they came through the white house, he had to approve it.

When it comes to this covid thing, most of the stuff was rubber stamped.

Yah I just hope he put a lot more thought into it than just approving it without a thought to the ol' economy. You know, the deal where you listen to lots of experts in different areas, ask good questions, weigh all the options, and choose the less bad one.

White house guidelines that hopefully, through the right set of rules and regulations, would be useful to limit the spread of the virus while keeping our economy hobbling along. Somewhere between the shut-it-all-down and what-about-my-rock-concert groups of thought.

We're not all epidemiologists and economists and scientists and sociologists. But as taxpayers we do employ a bunch of them. If the POTUS is just rubber stamping approvals without going through the hard process of decision making, or even worse, making decisions without listening to wide-ranging experts, then we're in big trouble.

@wildgrass said
Yah I just hope he put a lot more thought into it than just approving it without a thought to the ol' economy. You know, the deal where you listen to lots of experts in different areas, ask good questions, weigh all the options, and choose the less bad one.

White house guidelines that hopefully, through the right set of rules and regulations, would be useful to limit the ...[text shortened]... r even worse, making decisions without listening to wide-ranging experts, then we're in big trouble.

He was fed worthless numbers from projections proven totally false, got scared and listened to the establishment types.

That is how it played out, now 50.million Americans are unemployed and suicides are rocketing.

Maybe they should have listened to psychologists before putting the entire populatiin in solitary confinement and many forced into unemployment.

@eladar said
He was fed worthless numbers from projections proven totally false, got scared and listened to the establishment types.

Bla, bla, bla! Show some proof or shut up!

@handyandy said
Bla, bla, bla! Show some proof or shut up!

Who was put in charge of the Covid task force?

Establishment

@eladar said
He was fed worthless numbers from projections proven totally false, got scared and listened to the establishment types.

That is how it played out, now 50.million Americans are unemployed and suicides are rocketing.

Maybe they should have listened to psychologists before putting the entire populatiin in solitary confinement and many forced into unemployment.

Are you saying he didn't rubber stamp it? That he listened to the experts and they all told him lies? Imagine now you're the expert, dedicated your life to studying the economic impact of global pandemics, only to find yourself in the one moment that you'd be preparing for your whole life and the guy with the rubber stamps asks you and a group of your colleagues for your opinion. Are you all just going to lie to that guy? What evidence do you have to support that? Why?

Or, if we are to keep faith in government at all, maybe the path ultimately chosen was the least bad? We were lulled into complacency about the seriousness of viral outbreaks after vaccines made many really bad things go away for a whole generation? We lost faith in gov't entities like the CDC who were pestered with "why do we need you again?" kind of people? We then got rid of (or stopped listening to) important scientific personnel who track and study these things globally and come up with contingency plans for what to do if things go south? When things did go south, we flailed our arms and rubber stamped stuff and blamed others because we had no better excuses? We did what we had to do to slow a very infectious virus?

There were lots on the COVID task force who were publicly saying 'we don't know' all along. I dunno, this whole maximizing death rate deal seems contrived and unnecessary.

@wildgrass said
Are you saying he didn't rubber stamp it? That he listened to the experts and they all told him lies? Imagine now you're the expert, dedicated your life to studying the economic impact of global pandemics, only to find yourself in the one moment that you'd be preparing for your whole life and the guy with the rubber stamps asks you and a group of your colleagues for your op ...[text shortened]... n't know' all along. I dunno, this whole maximizing death rate deal seems contrived and unnecessary.

I am the expert because the models were proven hype?

Ok if That makes me the expert.

@eladar said
I am the expert because the models were proven hype?

Ok if That makes me the expert.

The thing that REALLY scares me is that someone with your freaky ideas has had access to the minds of innocent children out of sight of their parents.

@eladar said
I am the expert because the models were proven hype?

Ok if That makes me the expert.

metalbrain and I have had similar arguments about the misconceptions associated with mathematical models. It is unfortunate that the media latches onto them as a 'this is the thing that will happen' tool. However, science treats models as experiments, representations of ideas or concepts i.e. not real life. They are very useful for making decisions, but they are NOT designed to be future predictors. No one who is an expert would treat them as such.

The weather man is an expert who uses models and how often is he wrong? The leader of the free world did not use a model to shut down the entire economy, he based it off the real-life data coming out of other countries and our understanding of how viruses spread through populations.

@wildgrass said
metalbrain and I have had similar arguments about the misconceptions associated with mathematical models. It is unfortunate that the media latches onto them as a 'this is the thing that will happen' tool. However, science treats models as experiments, representations of ideas or concepts i.e. not real life. They are very useful for making decisions, but they are NOT designe ...[text shortened]... data coming out of other countries and our understanding of how viruses spread through populations.

Very useful for making decisions even when they are inaccurate. I suppose this is true, if you want to make it look like you are not talking out of your arse, as you talk out of your arse.

@eladar said
Very useful for making decisions even when they are inaccurate. I suppose this is true, if you want to make it look like you are not talking out of your arse, as you talk out of your arse.

Did this make sense in your head when you typed it?

Models aren't inaccurate because the hypothesis is wrong. They are inaccurate because, by design, they lack a complete understanding of the problem and we can't have all the data before decisions need to be made. Having a model is better than not having a model, but it isn't the whole story. Saying the models are wrong so the experts were disingenuous is faulty logic. They never said they were perfect predictors.

@wildgrass said
Did this make sense in your head when you typed it?

Models aren't inaccurate because the hypothesis is wrong. They are inaccurate because, by design, they lack a complete understanding of the problem and we can't have all the data before decisions need to be made. Having a model is better than not having a model, but it isn't the whole story. Saying the models are wrong so the experts were disingenuous is faulty logic. They never said they were perfect predictors.

Of course it makes sense.

Talk out of your arse.
Construct a model based on your false assumptions.
Use the results that would occur based on the false assumptions coming out of your arse to support your false theories.

It is all circular reasoning.