Originally posted by Taoman"I find the mystical understandings of all religions and metaphysical philosophies saying essentially the same thing."
I find the mystical understandings of all religions and metaphysical philosophies saying essentially the same thing.
Aldous Huxley wrote on the "Perennial Philosophy", a unifying concept emerging from 14th Century onwards that underlies many religious and non-religious understandings. In it he enumerates a number of unifying ideas.
I do not however think ...[text shortened]... rennial Philosophy is found in Wiki:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perennial_philosophy
Quite right!
The thing is though, and this is not my own invention, Christ is the all-in-all. There is only room at the top for one.
The Bible clearly delineates, or, if you will, establishes dualism. It(the Bible)establishes a stark contrast between good and evil. This cannot be denied. One can adopt the ideas and philosophies of other belief systems if one so chooses, but, in defense of the Bible, it is evident that good and evil don't mix.
I say evident because were the rubber meets the road in this world action speaks louder than words. Philosophical idealism be damned. It's all in the mind concerning philosophy, but it's cold hard truth to an empty stomach.
Mystical understandings and metaphysical philosophies are mere shadows of things true, but fall short of the mark because they are of human origins. That cannot be denied. It is human only in its totality.
I say it is human in its origin and totality because by your own admission, and not yours only and not to make it about you or me, if there is no God, then there is no author of life and knowledge and truth. Meaning then, that truth is in the eye of the beholder and subject to human interpretation exclusively.
I find that to be finite and stifling in an open minded approach to the answers to the questions of life's most perplexing realities.
For example; Why except the idea that one ceases to exist after death? Why does death exist? Why should one resign oneself to the specter of non-existence? And other questions.
I refuse to believe(and box in my mind)the explanation that primitive man invented God to spare himself from the fear of death. That's just an excuse to deny the existence of a life giver/Creator.
Why trust mans' explanations? Why put all of ones' eggs in one basket?
Originally posted by josephwWe are supposed to to take up our posts as God's agents and make sure we have our versions of the truth as refined as possible .
[b]"I find the mystical understandings of all religions and metaphysical philosophies saying essentially the same thing."
Quite right!
The thing is though, and this is not my own invention, Christ is the all-in-all. There is only room at the top for one.
The Bible clearly delineates, or, if you will, establishes dualism. It(the Bible)es iver/Creator.
Why trust mans' explanations? Why put all of ones' eggs in one basket?[/b]
You can cling to Jesus all you want but what fascinates me more is why Vishy wont admit a "clinginess" to Krsna , yet expouse all the philosophies that suuround the Krsna conciousness movement(?)
Originally posted by karoly aczelUnfortunately, it seems to be the same pattern over and over again. Whenever sufficiently challenged, they begin making vague and/or unfounded accusations and/or untrue disparaging remarks. It gets even worse if you challenge them on their accusations/disparaging remarks.
Yep, based on your posting, you would've been half way down my list with a little note saying "still not sure about this one" ,on the question of claiming to be god.
I see most of your posting as working through the nuts 'n' bolts of other posters arguements/posts. It must take you some time and patience to deal with your replies as well as you do. ...[text shortened]... it is not a joke.
Keep it up, Think of One, your efforts are not wasted on me , cheers.
It speaks directly toward the following statement I made that JW took exception to:
"Remarkable how many Christians seem to have a deep aversion to truth rather than an abiding love for it."
After being sufficiently challenged he initially tried avoidance and when called on it, the accusations began flowing freely. His actions show him to be one such Christian.
I have no idea what PF was going on about with the following, do you?
"Condemning an entire group to hell because of some writings that don not even out-date the Gettysburg Address is quite another."
I have no idea what "writings" he might be alluding to, no less how they might apply to me. Of course, when asked about it, he avoided answering.
Originally posted by josephwYou made a post filled with vague and/or unfounded accusations as a response to the following which I thought respectful enough:
I'm not throwing a hissy fit at all. I'm perfectly composed as always. You have misread me altogether.
I was engaged in a discussion with you until you began to obfuscate. I've been reading your posts and debates in this forum for years now. Your doing it again.
You do it with every single individual who has ever tried to have a normal, intelligent, ra ...[text shortened]... Therefore you are dishonest. The same as a liar. Don't forget what Jesus said by all means!
"You seem to have lost the thread of the discussion. Please reread our posts."
Even at that, I explained where you got off track.
Here you've again made a post filled with vague and/or unfounded accusations in response to that explanation.
You can claim to be "perfectly composed as always", yet the content of your posts seem to indicate otherwise.
The evidence clearly shows that it is you who have derailed this discussion. If you wish to continue it, you can begin by addressing the following which you've been avoiding:
"If a Christian tells lies, uses other forms of deceit, is a hypocrite, etc., has he embraced truth or as you say, 'Jesus'? I've known many Christians including several who regularly post on this forum who evidently think nothing of engaging in any or all of the above."
Originally posted by ThinkOfOneJust in case that wasn't a rhetorical question, No... no I have no idea what (s)he was on about....
Unfortunately, it seems to be the same pattern over and over again. Whenever sufficiently challenged, they begin making vague and/or unfounded accusations and/or untrue disparaging remarks. It gets even worse if you challenge them on their accusations/disparaging remarks.
It speaks directly toward the following statement I made that JW took exception ...[text shortened]... no less how they might apply to me. Of course, when asked about it, he avoided answering.
Originally posted by PinkFloydWell, it's apparent that you have little use for what Jesus actually said. In short, you don't believe Him. Instead you choose to believe the words of others.
And once again---ANYTHING is possible with God.
It's very simple: I believe God is more powerful than you do. I know that, though we sin, we can be saved by His grace alone. And ARE saved by such. No, it doesn't mean we can go out and lie, and cheat, and not pay our taxes, and vote for Palin, and do all manner of hideous things 🙂 but it DOES mean t ...[text shortened]... use I tell you the truth you believe me not" passage. Shall we move along to chapter 2?
It's unfortunate that so many call Him "Lord", yet follow the teachings of others.
Luke 6
46“Why do you call Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ and do not do what I say? 47“Everyone who comes to Me and hears My words and acts on them, I will show you whom he is like: 48he is like a man building a house, who dug deep and laid a foundation on the rock; and when a flood occurred, the torrent burst against that house and could not shake it, because it had been well built. 49“But the one who has heard and has not acted accordingly, is like a man who built a house on the ground without any foundation; and the torrent burst against it and immediately it collapsed, and the ruin of that house was great.”
Originally posted by karoly aczelI will assist you with that query:
We are supposed to to take up our posts as God's agents and make sure we have our versions of the truth as refined as possible .
You can cling to Jesus all you want but what fascinates me more is why Vishy wont admit a "clinginess" to Krsna , yet expouse all the philosophies that suuround the Krsna conciousness movement(?)
The Krishna Consciousness movement is really very new, about 50 yrs old and the teachings of the Vedas which are eternal are their source of knowledge.
A person who follows the Vedanta Sutra is called a Vaisnava, and the persons who follow the Hare Krishna way are also Vaisnava,s, but they have gathered together to create a preaching movement and they have been labelled by the public as ( the Hare Krishnas)
So if you want to give me a name, then Vaisnava will do.
I dont have anything to do with Hare Krishna, but I accept the Vedanta Sutra as they do, and I have the same literature in my home that they study.
The only reason I dont associate with the Hare Krsnas, is that they are getting very political and have become divided.
The Vedanta Sutra is for every living being, without distinction of color, birth, sex, age, faith, background, or anything.
I also have in my home, a Bible and a Koran and many other books for referencing.
The below excerpt I found was a helpful statement by someone with unifying wisdom. Swami Srawati sees how a particular approach to a type of yoga has reflections in other paths. It appears apropos to the current discussion.
"Karma Yoga in Other Traditions.
Though the path of Karma Yoga has been explained in detail by Yogic Science, references to it can also be found, directly or indirectly, in other traditions. (This is not surprising since Karma Yoga is a fundamental aspect of the Spiritual path).
Jesus said: "Thy will be done." The entire essence of Karma Yoga is contained in this pithy statement. One tries to tune in with the underlying Intelligence that exists in all things and act accordingly. There is another statement: "The Father (Cosmic Intelligence) and I are one, but the Father is greater
than I...the Father doeth the work." This is a mystical statement, uttered in a state of heightened awareness where the ego has evaporated. This is the state of Karma Yoga. There are many other such statements in the Bible and in other Christian texts such as ‘The Practice of the Presence of God’ by Brother Lawrence (in which every word illustrates the glory of Karma Yoga – certainly well worth reading) .
The Chinese sages knew of the importance of Karma Yoga. Lao Tsu, who is said to have written the famous Taoist text, the ‘Tao Te Ching’, repeatedly says that ‘one should act as though one is not acting.’ That is, one acts externally but remains in touch with the Tao (Inner Presence) which is beyond action. Taoism says that we should try less and less to act from the ego; do what circumstances demand - if we have to fight, then fight; if we have to be quiet, then be quiet. But always we should aspire to be in touch with the Inner Presence.
Taoism has always been concerned with the perfection of action (i.e. Karma Yoga), whatever our role in life may be. Whether we are a builder, craftsman, computer boffin, farmer, house-wife (or house-husband!), or Yoga teacher – Taoism emphasises, as does Yoga, the importance of perfecting our skills and doing our best, even in difficult circumstances and with limited materials.
The Tao Te Ching offers another pithy definition of Karma Yoga:
‘The man of power does not reveal that he possesses power; therefore, he keeps it.
The man of lesser power tries to continuously demonstrate that he has power; therefore, in fact, he is without it.
Moreover, the man of wisdom, the sage, does not really act, whereas others (the unwise) do.’
Read the Tao Te Ching for yourself. Every line indicates the importance of blending into situations - not egotistically imposing oneself, but allowing oneself to respond appropriately - being Aware moment to moment. This is Karma Yoga. This doesn’t mean that one is passive, or indifferent, but rather that one is ready to act as and when required.
There is a beautiful quote by the sage Chuang Tsu:
"When you are betting for tiles in an archery contest, you shoot with skill. When you are betting for fancy buckles, you worry about your aim. And when you are betting for gold, you are a nervous wreck.”
Our inherent skill is the same in all these cases, but it is our attachment to the perceived outcome that creates such different results.
Karma Yoga helps to bring about inner calm in all situations. Judaism, Sufism, Buddhism, Sanatan Dharma (‘The Perennial Way’, also
known as Hinduism, from which Yoga has evolved) and other religions, as well as various mystical systems, all emphasise what we would call Karma Yoga. They all indicate that acting with Awareness can take us deeper in our Spiritual perception and understanding.
They all advocate that freedom (from ignorance) doesn’t come from ‘escaping from life, but rather ‘escaping into Life.’ Every act - eating, talking, walking, digging, washing, thinking - presents us with the opportunity of being in touch with Reality – that is, Life (of the Spirit) as opposed to mundane life (of the senses). What is required is the right attitude, the right aspiration and the humility to accept
that, as individuals, we are severely limited in our understanding and our capacity to act."
http://www.mandalayoga.net/index-what-en-karma_yoga.html
A peaceful and happy Christmas time to all, Christian and non-Christian alike.
@ThinkOfOne, 15 Dec 10, 16:22 - This is a very good post as it sums up unifying threads of thought across a spectrum of religious views!!!! 😀
Originally posted by ThinkOfOneI shall be reporrting this one as well. You made a false claim..."You don't believe Him." That is a blatant lie: I DO believe the Lord Jesus and I am a Christian. I never claimed to be a better Christian than you or anyone else, but I AM a Christian. Your right to demean me has just ended.
Well, it's apparent that you have little use for what Jesus actually said. In short, you don't believe Him. Instead you choose to believe the words of others.
It's unfortunate that so many call Him "Lord", yet follow the teachings of others.
Luke 6
46“Why do you call Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ and do not do what I say? 47“Everyone who comes to Me and hear ...[text shortened]... rrent burst against it and immediately it collapsed, and the ruin of that house was great.”
Originally posted by PinkFloydDon't know how you can reasonably say that I made a "false claim". Perhaps you need to go back and reread our discussion. I can only go by what you post.
I shall be reporrting this one as well. You made a false claim..."You don't believe Him." That is a blatant lie: I DO believe the Lord Jesus and I am a Christian. I never claimed to be a better Christian than you or anyone else, but I AM a Christian. Your right to demean me has just ended.