07 Jan 06
1 edit
Originally posted by no1marauderHere are the two portions in context:
I guess because the Matthew verse is directly contradicted by Romans 10:13 though I'm sure someone will do the appropriate hand stands to claim it isn't.
Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
Rom 10:11 For the Scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
Rom 10:12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
Rom 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
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Mat 7:12 Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.
Mat 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
Mat 7:14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
Mat 7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
Mat 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
Mat 7:18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
Mat 7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
Mat 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Mat 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
Mat 7:25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not; for it was founded upon a rock.
Mat 7:26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
Mat 7:27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.
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It's quite obvious from the portion in Romans that it isn't merely a verbal plea or confession -- but a deeper belief is required; and how do you call on God anyway, without first believing that there is anything to call on? Verse 13 was merely a continuation of 12 i.e. anybody could be saved - not only the Jews. This concept of belief is reiterated by Christ as well:
Mar 1:14 Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God,
Mar 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.
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Mar 16:14 Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.
Mar 16:15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
Mar 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
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Luk 8:10 And he said, Unto you it is given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God: but to others in parables; that seeing they might not see, and hearing they might not understand.
Luk 8:11 Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God.
Luk 8:12 Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.
Luk 8:13 They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away.
Luk 8:14 And that which fell among thorns are they, which, when they have heard, go forth, and are choked with cares and riches and pleasures of this life, and bring no fruit to perfection.
Luk 8:15 But that on the good ground are they, which in an honest and good heart, having heard the word, keep it, and bring forth fruit with patience.
Luk 8:16 No man, when he hath lighted a candle, covereth it with a vessel, or putteth it under a bed; but setteth it on a candlestick, that they which enter in may see the light.
Luk 8:17 For nothing is secret, that shall not be made manifest; neither any thing hid, that shall not be known and come abroad.
Luk 8:18 Take heed therefore how ye hear: for whosoever hath, to him shall be given; and whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken even that which he seemeth to have.
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Joh 3:10 Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things?
Joh 3:11 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness.
Joh 3:12 If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?
Joh 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.
Joh 3:14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:
Joh 3:15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Joh 3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
Joh 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
There are verses where Christ emphasises good works eg. Matt 25:31-46; Matt 7:21 etc.
I’ve noted on this forum that Paul is claimed to make no mention of good works:
Rom 2:5 But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
Rom 2:6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds:
Rom 2:7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, eternal life:
Rom 2:8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath...
07 Jan 06
Originally posted by no1marauderSee as a Born Again Christian I would call you a lost person becasue you do not know the truth.
I guess because the Matthew verse is directly contradicted by Romans 10:13 though I'm sure someone will do the appropriate hand stands to claim it isn't.
If you were saved you would not see it as a contradiction.
A goat is a lost person.
A sheep is a saved person.
07 Jan 06
Originally posted by frogstompYou calling me a goat, when you are the one with the satan figure as your little picture. I can see where you are blinded by satan.
There wasnt anything lost. you goat
I will tell you a little story, when I first got saved, I visited my cousin and his e-mail address had 666 in it. So then I told my ex-girlfriends dad and we prayed about it together and a few weeks latter it had been change to 69.
07 Jan 06
1 edit
Originally posted by RBHILLAnd that's an improvement? Merciful Jesus! RB, you have had some memorable posts in the past. I think this one tops them all.
You calling me a goat, when you are the one with the satan figure as your little picture. I can see where you are blinded by satan.
I will tell you a little story, when I first got saved, I visited my cousin and his e-mail address had 666 in it. So then I told my ex-girlfriends dad and we prayed about it together and a few weeks latter it had been change to 69.
07 Jan 06
1 edit
Originally posted by kirksey957Actually, Kirk, if anything...it's more ammunition to consider him an artificial construct placed here for our amusement. Because anyone, and I mean anyone, would see the humour in that. 😵
And that's an improvement? Merciful Jesus! RB, you have had some memorable posts in the past. I think this one tops them all.
07 Jan 06
Originally posted by David CThat is becasue you are of the world.
Actually, Kirk, if anything...it's more ammunition to consider him an artificial construct placed here for our amusement. Because anyone, and I mean anyone, would see the humour in that. 😵
And the world dislikes Christian.
And you hate use becasue we are saved and healed and you do not want to believe it.
07 Jan 06
2 edits
Originally posted by RBHILLArgument from Anecdote
You calling me a goat, when you are the one with the satan figure as your little picture. I can see where you are blinded by satan.
I will tell you a little story, when I first got saved, I visited my cousin and his e-mail address had 666 in it. So then I told my ex-girlfriends dad and we prayed about it together and a few weeks latter it had been change to 69.
1)Arbitrary story involving a prayer coming true.
2)Therefore, God exists.
"And you hate use becasue we are saved and healed and you do not want to believe it."
Many of us feel no desire to believe bullshit.
Saved from what?
07 Jan 06
Originally posted by lukemcmullanHell fire
[b]Argument from Anecdote
1)Arbitrary story involving a prayer coming true.
2)Therefore, God exists.
"And you hate use becasue we are saved and healed and you do not want to believe it."
Many of us feel no desire to believe bullshit.
Saved from what?[/b]
07 Jan 06
1 edit
Originally posted by RBHILLThat anecdote is certainly an inspiring story of God's power to change an e-mail address through prayer.
You calling me a goat, when you are the one with the satan figure as your little picture. I can see where you are blinded by satan.
I will tell you a little story, when I first got saved, I visited my cousin and his e-mail address had 666 in it. So then I told my ex-girlfriends dad and we prayed about it together and a few weeks latter it had been change to 69.
07 Jan 06
Originally posted by HalitoseI tend to agree, but the fact is passages from Romans are quoted out of context to claim that mere belief will get you salvation. Matthew 7:22 is even more explicit that just because someone thinks they are doing God's work is no guarantee of salvation. RB take notes.
Here are the two portions in context:
Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
Rom 10:11 For the Scripture sa ...[text shortened]... ontentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath...