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28 Oct 15
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Originally posted by KellyJayWhat I am saying is simple enough, once a person receives the gift of holy spirit, he cannot lose it. It is seed, incorruptible. That person can not lose their salvation.
Well, fine but are you telling me that someone who lives after the flesh and not after the
Spirit is saved? Someone who rejects God, and has made a choice to be a servant to sin is
saved? We are all under grace right now even the unbelievers so that they can take their
next breath, but being saved by grace is through faith, and those that are rejecting G ...[text shortened]... ly given to sin and reject God and still be
saved, you are dead in your sins, not alive to God.
1 Cor 3:15
If anyone's work is burned, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.
NKJV
And the person you describe never received holy spirit... this is an unbeliever.
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28 Oct 15
Originally posted by Rajk999Matters not what I want, just what the bible teaches. And you are clueless. You have never had sound bible teaching aside from your cult religion.
You say this :
[b]the permanence of the binding legal agreement.
And this:
you make salvation sound conditional on doing what God called us to
Seems like you want a binding legal agreement but you dont want the conditions. Salvation is conditional and both parties to the agreement have a duty to fulfill
What you believe is that God must ...[text shortened]... al life even though you are not fulling your duty and meeting the requirements for eternal life.[/b]
28 Oct 15
Originally posted by divegeesterHe keeps saying that the Christians here lean on "OSAS" as a reason to "defy" God.
I seems odd to me that you are still berating others in this thread when you cannot explain what you yourself mean by what youngster earlier. I think I finally understand you know: you attack others based a carefully selected group of scriptures but you cannot explain in simple practical terms what it is you believe and therefore your particularly legalist view of Christianity fails to resonate.
I'd say it's pretty obvious that his own dogma can be summed up in "DAISNAID".
28 Oct 15
1 edit
Originally posted by checkbaiterThe trouble with what was described to me, I feel it was the same way.
What I am saying is simple enough, once a person receives the gift of holy spirit, he cannot lose it. It is seed, incorruptible. That person can not lose their salvation.
[b]1 Cor 3:15
If anyone's work is burned, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.
NKJV
And the person you describe never received holy spirit... this is an unbeliever.[/b]
You cannot say this person was saved and they never left living their lives in the flesh.
28 Oct 15
Originally posted by checkbaiterI guess you ran out of Bible references to support your foolish doctrine .. huh. You are right and I thank God that I never had a sound bible indoctrination of false doctrines to deal with.
Matters not what I want, just what the bible teaches. And you are clueless. You have never had sound bible teaching aside from your cult religion.
The supporters, the condoners, the justifers of sin, evil and unrighteousness will get their just reward... Im sure
28 Oct 15
Originally posted by checkbaiterSo those you know who you claim fell away, they are now walking in the flesh not in the
I know Christians who were fervent and fell away. They have no reward but they are still saved.
BTW... I have been at this for 21 years here and 41 in my lifetime.
Is there a seniority condition I am missing here?
Spirit, they are no longer living in faith, but walking in the flesh denying God, they are
dead in their sins and not alive in God?
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28 Oct 15
Originally posted by KellyJayA couple people who were fervently serving seemed to want to go their own way. Don't go to church anymore, just want to be left alone for whatever reason.
So those you know who you claim fell away, they are now walking in the flesh not in the
Spirit, they are no longer living in faith, but walking in the flesh denying God, they are
dead in their sins and not alive in God?
I didn't say anything about denying God, I don't think they do.
My point is there are good Christian people who can be deceived and go back to their old lives. Satan is crafty and has caused many to stumble. These people have holy spirit, nothing changes as far as salvation.
They will still be there at the rapture. This is what I believe the bible teaches.
Rajk is in a works oriented cult which he himself cannot do but tries to promote his religion anyway, perhaps thinking he is pleasing God.
Originally posted by checkbaiterI am in no cult but you are welcome to believe and say what you like .. dont really matter. However if you claim the Bible says something then you should be able to back it up.
A couple people who were fervently serving seemed to want to go their own way. Don't go to church anymore, just want to be left alone for whatever reason.
I didn't say anything about denying God, I don't think they do.
My point is there are good Christian people who can be deceived and go back to their old lives. Satan is crafty and has caused many to ...[text shortened]... himself cannot do but tries to promote his religion anyway, perhaps thinking he is pleasing God.
You said this:
My point is there are good Christian people who can be deceived and go back to their old lives. Satan is crafty and has caused many to stumble. These people have holy spirit, nothing changes as far as salvation. They will still be there at the rapture. This is what I believe the bible teaches.
So please show where you get that in the Bible. As far as I can see Paul did comment on these very same people and his conclusion about their fate is poles apart from what you say:
For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. (Hebrews 6:4-6 KJV)
Please spare me the nonsense that people have tried to explain this passage to me. Paul is very very clear that these people are in dire trouble regarding their salvation. Other writers have similar statements and there is nothing positive about these people who fall back into their worldly sinful liffestyle... nothing .. its all death and destruction.
28 Oct 15
From Peter:
For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
(2 Peter 2:20-21 KJV)
28 Oct 15
1 edit
Originally posted by checkbaiterYou need to be clear. I get struggles, we all have them. Jesus promised never to leave us
A couple people who were fervently serving seemed to want to go their own way. Don't go to church anymore, just want to be left alone for whatever reason.
I didn't say anything about denying God, I don't think they do.
My point is there are good Christian people who can be deceived and go back to their old lives. Satan is crafty and has caused many to ...[text shortened]... himself cannot do but tries to promote his religion anyway, perhaps thinking he is pleasing God.
or forsake us, and some times all we got going for us is a mustered seed of faith, but that
is all we need for even mountains.
If you are telling me that you think you can live a life in the flesh without God, not walking in
faith with God and be saved, your message and Rajk are not to different, he just leaves
God out of the picture all together, and says people can be saved without God too, but he
throws in works to justify them.
The seed and the sower tells us that sometimes the bad and good things in this life can
choke out the life, that the enemy attacks are effective. I just don't want to confuse anyone
into thinking they can live a life without God and think they are going to please God,
because that is not true. He will say depart from me I never knew you!
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28 Oct 15
Originally posted by KellyJayIf you are telling me that you think you can live a life in the flesh without God, not walking in
You need to be clear. I get struggles, we all have them. Jesus promised never to leave us
or forsake us, and some times all we got going for us is a mustered seed of faith, but that
is all we need for even mountains.
If you are telling me that you think you can live a life in the flesh without God, not walking in
faith with God and be saved, your mess ...[text shortened]... are going to please God,
because that is not true. He will say depart from me I never knew you!
faith with God and be saved, your message and Rajk are not to different, he just leaves
God out of the picture all together, and says people can be saved without God too, but he
throws in works to justify them.
I think this is impossible and a moot point.
29 Oct 15
Originally posted by checkbaiterSo be clear here, you think someone who is saved and filled with the Spirit cannot or would
[b]If you are telling me that you think you can live a life in the flesh without God, not walking in
faith with God and be saved, your message and Rajk are not to different, he just leaves
God out of the picture all together, and says people can be saved without God too, but he
throws in works to justify them.
I think this is impossible and a moot point.[/b]
not reject God and live a life in the flesh, so that anyone who is living in the flesh was
never really saved, even if they claimed they once where?