26 Mar 09
2 edits
Originally posted by orion25I believe God is willing and able to prevent evil, and is in the middle
And since you're so smart solve this little riddle for me will you?
"If God is willing to prevent evil, but is not able to
Then He is not omnipotent.
If He is able, but not willing
Then He is malevolent.
If He is both able and willing
Then whence cometh evil?
If He is neither able nor willing
Then why call Him God?"
-Epicurus
of the process of doing that very thing now. If you look at the
scriptures focusing on the Creation story you will see that God was
acting, His creation was made for a reason and it was called very
good when it was done. Evil appeared, it is showing itself for what it
is, when that is fully done, it will be judged, and all of creation will see
this.
Evil and those that work it, will be judged forever, and then all of
those that followed it and love it except those which were saved will
be cast into a lake of fire prepared for the devil and his angels forever.
Creation will then be completely restored to what it should have
been, to be the Creation God wants, and evil will be done away with
forever.
When God created us He prepared away to save us from evil, so evil
is just a small bump in the road whose time is very short in the eternal
scheme of things.
Why God didn't just flush all that turned toward evil at the very
moment it happened I believe just goes towards God's grace and
mercy. He pulled those who answered His call out of the evil of this
life for His glory and honor, showing that evil as bad as it is cannot
hold back love and mercy. One of our grand issues is that we believe
that it is God who is at fault here, when in fact we are the selfish ones
that live in our sins and love it so.
Kelly
26 Mar 09
Originally posted by Andrew HamiltonHere is a clue, self-evident will not fly with someone who disagrees
[b]…It doesn't but if all I ever said was the horse proves your wrong, and
do not spell out why you'd be in the SAME BOAT I'm in with your
examples.
..… (my emphasis)
Here we go again -the usual tactic of pretending you don’t know what it self-evident to attempt to avoid the argument;
Houses have NOT been directly observed to undergo ...[text shortened]... ern times -that’s why they are not in the “same boat” as you said -but you already knew this.[/b]
with your views! I can say God is King of the Universe and it is
self-evident does that mean you HAVE to accept my word on it?
If you think it is so right there for all to see explain the process to me
it should not be that hard if it is 'self-evident' don't hold back, just
show me what it is I'm missing! I think it should be easy if it is as
self-evident as you claim. Why would the reason I gave not be thought
of as just as valid as the one you claim is right in front of me? You
have some hidden information your holding out on me?
Kelly
26 Mar 09
Originally posted by Andrew Hamilton"Mmmm -that should take you about 50 seconds of reading AT MOST I guess -there isn't much there to read. You don't even have to go back a page -all posts after those questions are, so far, on this page."
[b]….As I said, you telling me these are proofs is not enough, WALK me
through this, show my why you believe this to be true!
..…
Please stop insulting our intelligence by pretending what is self-evident isn’t so.
Ok -so I will “WALK you through this”; 😛
I have basically already said this again and again using different words from here b ...[text shortened]... continual refusal to answer my questions (and other people’s questions) will just confirm this.[/b]
I covered that page looked for your quesitons if you didn't see them
addressed I suggest you have pity on me and number the ones you
care about so I can see them, beause I guess I cannot.
I'll look for your questions on that page after you do this to make
sure what you said above was true, and to see how I could have
missed what you were asking.
Kelly
26 Mar 09
Originally posted by KellyJaydid anyone ask you if there is a place in the bible that says noah took dinosaurs on the boat? in the book of job i believe there is a dragon. does that mean we are to discover dragon skeletons in the future?
"Mmmm -that should take you about 50 seconds of reading AT MOST I guess -there isn't much there to read. You don't even have to go back a page -all posts after those questions are, so far, on this page."
I covered that page looked for your quesitons if you didn't see them
addressed I suggest you have pity on me and number the ones you
care about so I c ...[text shortened]... you said above was true, and to see how I could have
missed what you were asking.
Kelly
26 Mar 09
1 edit
Originally posted by ZahlanziThe Flood Covers the Earth
did anyone ask you if there is a place in the bible that says noah took dinosaurs on the boat? in the book of job i believe there is a dragon. does that mean we are to discover dragon skeletons in the future?
Gen 7:1-4
1 When everything was ready, the Lord said to Noah, “Go into the boat with all your family, for among all the people of the earth, I can see that you alone are righteous. 2 Take with you seven pairs—male and female—of each animal I have approved for eating and for sacrifice,[a] and take one pair of each of the others. 3 Also take seven pairs of every kind of bird. There must be a male and a female in each pair to ensure that all life will survive on the earth after the flood. 4 Seven days from now I will make the rains pour down on the earth. And it will rain for forty days and forty nights, until I have wiped from the earth all the living things I have created.”
If God created all life at the same time, they would have had to have
been on the ark to be saved, it does not mean they lived long
afterward, but they had to have been on it.
Kelly
26 Mar 09
Originally posted by KellyJaywhy had to have been?
The Flood Covers the Earth
Gen 7:1-4
1 When everything was ready, the Lord said to Noah, “Go into the boat with all your family, for among all the people of the earth, I can see that you alone are righteous. 2 Take with you seven pairs—male and female—of each animal I have approved for eating and for sacrifice,[a] and take one pair of each of the others. ...[text shortened]... o be saved, it does not mean they lived long
afterward, but they had to have been on it.
Kelly
"Scientific creationists interpret the fossils found in the earth's rocks as the remains of animals that perished in the Noachian Deluge. Ironically, they often cite the sheer number of fossils in 'fossil graveyards' as evidence for the Flood. In particular, creationists seem enamored by the Karroo Formation in Africa, which is estimated to contain the remains of 800 billion vertebrate animals (see Whitcomb and Morris, p. 160; Gish, p. 61). As pseudoscientists, creationists dare not test this major hypothesis that all of the fossilized animals died in the Flood.
"Robert E. Sloan, a paleontologist at the University of Minnesota, has studied the Karroo Formation. He asserts that the animals fossilized there range from the size of a small lizard to the size of a cow, with the average animal perhaps the size of a fox. A minute's work with a calculator shows that, if the 800 billion animals in the Karoo formation could be resurrected, there would be twenty-one of them for every acre of land on earth. Suppose we assume (conservatively, I think) that the Karroo Formation contains 1 percent of the vertebrate [land] fossils on earth. Then when the Flood began, there must have been at least 2100 living animals per acre, ranging from tiny shrews to immense dinosaurs. To a noncreationist mind, that seems a bit crowded."
26 Mar 09
Originally posted by KellyJaywhy no human artifacts are found except in the very uppermost strata. If, at the time of the Flood, the earth was overpopulated by people with technology for shipbuilding, why were none of their tools or buildings mixed with trilobite or dinosaur fossils?
The Flood Covers the Earth
Gen 7:1-4
1 When everything was ready, the Lord said to Noah, “Go into the boat with all your family, for among all the people of the earth, I can see that you alone are righteous. 2 Take with you seven pairs—male and female—of each animal I have approved for eating and for sacrifice,[a] and take one pair of each of the others. ...[text shortened]... o be saved, it does not mean they lived long
afterward, but they had to have been on it.
Kelly
26 Mar 09
Originally posted by FabianFnasthe problem is that if you allow him to hold the bible as absolutely true, there are few things you can say that can phase him. how did the predators survive? well they were all vegetarians on noah's ark(but noah did ate meat though). where were the pandas and the koalas? on the ark, god put them there. how did ther edinosaurs fit on the arc? they just hatched. how did measles survive? god sent the plagues of measles to punish the people after noah.
Because he doesn't believe in science, including dendrochronology, nor radiometric dating, nor anything if it has to do with science.
i can offer answers to many things because once i took the liberty to hold something unquestionable, i can invent anything or simply say, i dunno, god must have did something, to not contradict that unquestionable something.
26 Mar 09
Originally posted by ZahlanziHe doesn't know, and he doesn't care. He can as likely have his religious opinion that the earth is flat. Question: "But it doesn't look flat from space?" Answer: "That's what *you* think." :/
the problem is that if you allow him to hold the bible as absolutely true, there are few things you can say that can phase him. how did the predators survive? well they were all vegetarians on noah's ark(but noah did ate meat though). where were the pandas and the koalas? on the ark, god put them there. how did ther edinosaurs fit on the arc? they just hatc ...[text shortened]... ply say, i dunno, god must have did something, to not contradict that unquestionable something.
26 Mar 09
3 edits
Originally posted by KellyJayNo surprises here, you still haven’t answered any of my questions. Everybody can see you are now just being silly by pretending my self-evident statement isn’t so -proof for all to see that you lost the argument for you have no answers. you just are making an idiot of yourself - the only problem is you just don’t have the intelligence to see it.
Here is a clue, self-evident will not fly with someone who disagrees
with your views! I can say God is King of the Universe and it is
self-evident does that mean you HAVE to accept my word on it?
If you think it is so right there for all to see explain the process to me
it should not be that hard if it is 'self-evident' don't hold back, just
show me wh im is right in front of me? You
have some hidden information your holding out on me?
Kelly
Reminder for other readers:
“…
AN OBSERVED EXAMPLE OF EVOLUTION MAKING CHANGES IN A SPECIES OF LIVING THING IS PROOF THAT EVOLUTION CAN MAKE CHANGES IN A SPECIES OF LIVING THING.
…”
This is my assertion I made earlier that KellyJay has been and is currently making out is NOT self-evident 😛
Is there anyone here (theist or atheist -makes no difference) that thinks this assertion is NOT self-evident other than (apparently) KellyJay ?
Who else thinks it is blatantly obvious that KellyJay is both wrong here and he must know it!?
26 Mar 09
Originally posted by Andrew HamiltonNot me.
Who else thinks it is blatantly obvious that KellyJay is both wrong here and he must know it!?
And further - I cannot think of one sole reason why he persists in doing this! He must know he is dead wrong. He cannot be as ignorant as he shows, I mean: He can read and write, right?
26 Mar 09
Originally posted by FabianFnasyou are not viewing this from the right perspective. it is not he that should be proven wrong. in his mind, this is only a matter of whether god was wrong. which in his eyes it is clearly not the case. as such, you may make him doubt the bible for several seconds, but even so, he will simply consider he and all of us poor heathens are not smart enough and that god was way more clever than us.
Not me.
And further - I cannot think of one sole reason why he persists in doing this! He must know he is dead wrong. He cannot be as ignorant as he shows, I mean: He can read and write, right?
26 Mar 09
Originally posted by Andrew HamiltonI asked you to number your questions, the ones I'm most interested
No surprises here, you still haven’t answered any of my questions. Everybody can see you are now just being silly by pretending my self-evident statement isn’t so -proof for all to see that you lost the argument for you have no answers. you just are making an idiot of yourself - the only problem is you just don’t have the intelligence to see it.
[ ...[text shortened]...
Who else thinks it is blatantly obvious that KellyJay is both wrong here and he must know it!?
in are the ones you said were on that page, I didn't see anything I
did not address and you were still claiming I didn't answer your
questions. So if you actually had questions on that page I missed
please stop wining about them them post them, number them if you
will and I'll address them. This is now my 2nd request you produce
your questions. Maybe your questions are as self-evident as
your evident as your evidence is.
It isn't my fault your self-evident proofs are not self-evident to all
just to the true believers.
Kelly