28 Aug 12
1 edit
The original group of this 144,000 were referred to as the "first born" as they were the first to go to heaven after Jesus had accended:
Hebrews 12:23
New Living Translation (NLT)
23 You have come to the assembly of God’s firstborn children, whose names are written in heaven. You have come to God himself, who is the judge over all things. You have come to the spirits of the righteous ones in heaven who have now been made perfect.
They were also called the "first fruits":
Revelation 14:4
New King James Version (NKJV)
4 These are the ones who were not defiled with women, for they are virgins. These are the ones who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These were redeemed[a] from among men, being firstfruits to God and to the Lamb.
29 Aug 12
Originally posted by galveston75You know there are qualifications to enter the spiritual Heaven to see the Kingdom of God. I am sure you can read what the Watchtower teaches about what the bible says.
So anyone can go that is "good" or are there qualifications? What does the bible say about them?
29 Aug 12
Originally posted by RJHindsSo do you believe there are qualifications in the Bible? Do you personally feel you meet them? You don't have to answer but just asking...
You know there are qualifications to enter the spiritual Heaven to see the Kingdom of God. I am sure you can read what the Watchtower teaches about what the bible says.
29 Aug 12
Originally posted by galveston75So you at least agree that the 144k are all men? before one of you claimed you knew a women who claimed to be one of the 144k.
The original group of this 144,000 were referred to as the "first born" as they were the first to go to heaven after Jesus had accended:
Hebrews 12:23
New Living Translation (NLT)
23 You have come to the assembly of God’s firstborn children, whose names are written in heaven. You have come to God himself, who is the judge over all things. You have ...[text shortened]... er He goes. These were redeemed[a] from among men, being firstfruits to God and to the Lamb.
Manny
29 Aug 12
Originally posted by galveston75Nobody G-man meets the qualifications. It is the free gift from God that no man should boast before God and say look at my deeds and how good I am God 🙂 It is all the Grace of God. The fruit is not forced it is the natural thing to do once God has indeed saved you.
So do you believe there are qualifications in the Bible? Do you personally feel you meet them? You don't have to answer but just asking...
Manny
29 Aug 12
Originally posted by menace71So if there are no qualifications, then why does the Bible clearly state them?
Nobody G-man meets the qualifications. It is the free gift from God that no man should boast before God and say look at my deeds and how good I am God 🙂 It is all the Grace of God. The fruit is not forced it is the natural thing to do once God has indeed saved you.
Manny
29 Aug 12
Originally posted by galveston75If the 144,000 are the first group to go to Heaven after Jesus, why can't there be a second group. Why call them the "first born" or "first fruits" if they are to be the only group?
The original group of this 144,000 were referred to as the "first born" as they were the first to go to heaven after Jesus had accended:
Hebrews 12:23
New Living Translation (NLT)
23 You have come to the assembly of God’s firstborn children, whose names are written in heaven. You have come to God himself, who is the judge over all things. You have ...[text shortened]... er He goes. These were redeemed[a] from among men, being firstfruits to God and to the Lamb.
30 Aug 12
Originally posted by RJHindsThere is no mention of a second heavenly group but only of the Great Crowd. Matt 5:5 explains where they are to live.
If the 144,000 are the first group to go to Heaven after Jesus, why can't there be a second group. Why call them the "first born" or "first fruits" if they are to be the only group?
30 Aug 12
Originally posted by galveston75Here is the whole teaching:
There is no mention of a second heavenly group but only of the Great Crowd. Matt 5:5 explains where they are to live.
And seeing the multitudes, He went up on a mountain, and when He was seated His disciples came to Him. Then He opened His mouth and taught them, saying:
“Blessed are the poor in spirit,
For theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Blessed are those who mourn,
For they shall be comforted.
Blessed are the meek,
For they shall inherit the earth.
Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness,
For they shall be filled.
Blessed are the merciful,
For they shall obtain mercy.
Blessed are the pure in heart,
For they shall see God.
Blessed are the peacemakers,
For they shall be called sons of God.
Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness’ sake,
For theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
“Blessed are you when they revile and persecute you, and say all kinds of evil against you falsely for My sake. Rejoice and be exceedingly glad, for great is your reward in heaven, for so they persecuted the prophets who were before you.
(Matthew 5:1-12 NKJV)
You seem to have overlooked all this talk about heaven. It seems to me that more than one group is going to heaven.
30 Aug 12
Originally posted by RJHindsHe is initially speaking of the first fruits or chosen ones, the 144,000. But if you really notice he mentions ones who inherit the earth. He also mentioned other times that there were only ((((( 2 )))))) groups of humans that had his favor.
Here is the whole teaching:
And seeing the multitudes, He went up on a mountain, and when He was seated His disciples came to Him. Then He opened His mouth and taught them, saying:
[b]“Blessed are the poor in spirit,
For theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Blessed are those who mourn,
For they shall be comforted.
Blessed are the meek,
For they ...[text shortened]... rlooked all this talk about heaven. It seems to me that more than one group is going to heaven.[/b]
So if one group inherits the earth, that clearly means they will be on earth, not in heaven.
30 Aug 12
Originally posted by galveston75It makes more sense that it is the 144,000 that are ruling on the Earth then, since that would leave room for others to be ruled over. Heaven seems a more logical place for the great crowd that no one can number. Perhaps they both have access to Heaven. 😏
He is initially speaking of the first fruits or chosen ones, the 144,000. But if you really notice he mentions ones who inherit the earth. He also mentioned other times that there were only ((((( 2 )))))) groups of humans that had his favor.
So if one group inherits the earth, that clearly means they will be on earth, not in heaven.
HalleluYah !!! Praise the Lord! Glory be to God! Holy! Holy! Holy!
30 Aug 12
Originally posted by RJHindsOk. Lol. You know that's not what the Bible says but you twist and move words around as you do with the trinity and come up with these strange ideas.
It makes more sense that it is the 144,000 that are ruling on the Earth then, since that would leave room for others to be ruled over. Heaven seems a more logical place for the great crowd that no one can number. Perhaps they both have access to Heaven. 😏
HalleluYah !!! Praise the Lord! Glory be to God! Holy! Holy! Holy!
Perhaps you should not come up with these ideas on your own but do this:
Proverbs 3:5-6
Amplified Bible (AMP)
5 Lean on, trust in, and be confident in the Lord with all your heart and mind and ((((( do not rely on your own insight or understanding.)))))))
6 In all your ways know, recognize, and acknowledge Him, and He will direct and make straight and plain your paths.
Also the Bible says:
Hebrews 10:24-25
Amplified Bible (AMP)
24 And let us consider and give [a]attentive, continuous care to watching over one another, studying how we may stir up (stimulate and incite) to love and helpful deeds and noble activities,
25 Not forsaking or neglecting to assemble together [as believers], as is the habit of some people, but admonishing (warning, urging, and encouraging) one another, and all the more faithfully as you see the day approaching.
Only by being with these type people and God's direct teachings can you spiritually progress and then not have to come up with these supposed answers on your own.
Just a thought........