14 Mar 05
Originally posted by pcaspianHonestly? I'd investigate his claim and assume he probably misinterpreted a non supernatural experience; but, you never know. If he had something I felt was solid I'd listen.
Originally posted by AThousandYoung
[b]
It depends how outlandish the claim is; how trustworthy the person is; and what evidence the person can provide for the claim whether or not I believe the person's claim. If the claims is not true, for it to be a lie there must be intent to deceive and the person must know their claim is not true.
Ok ...[text shortened]... icate it. Is this a shortcoming of science or a failsafe measure to guarantee truth ?
[/b]
I guess my perspective is most like your 3, but 'assuming he's deluded' is too harsh. It wouldn't be like when some people I know talk about how the TV is talking to them or anything...unless that was how my friend found God!
I know a lady who found God because her dead mother came back in the form of a cat and started talking to her outside her window. She's taking medication now for her delusional schizophrenia.
I would investigate the leap from evidence to conclusion with skepticism, which is a very legitimately scientific way to approach someone's claim.
I am not sure what sort of evidence I would even want to replicate, as usually it's the leap from evidence to conclusion that I find to be flawed. One of the phenomena that causes people to believe in God, astrology, that they are psychic, that their mother is psychic, or whatever, is selective perception. One may randomly run into various religious figures talking about various parts of the Bible, and one may glance at the Bible now and then and thing about some passage or another, but when the two happen together it MUST be God talking to you! How else could there be such a coincidence, one right after the other?
15 Mar 05
Originally posted by pcaspianI can't be much clearer can I?
Originally posted by Maustrauser
[b]
1. Resurrection has never been seen before or since (Christ's resurrection). It breaks nearly all physical laws.
So you're claiming that people that have been declared dead have not come back to life ?[/b]
Nobody who has died has been brought back to life.
Died = brain dead. No functional brain activity.
16 Mar 05
Originally posted by pcaspianSo when it's said that Jesus was resurrected, you think it was the same thing as when a doctor declares someone dead but they come back to life? I can buy that, sure. There's nothing supernatural or amazing about that.
Originally posted by Maustrauser
[b]
1. Resurrection has never been seen before or since (Christ's resurrection). It breaks nearly all physical laws.
So you're claiming that people that have been declared dead have not come back to life ?[/b]
17 Mar 05
Originally posted by Maustrauser
I can't be much clearer can I?
Nobody who has died has been brought back to life.
Died = brain dead. No functional brain activity.
Ok, so the only logical explanation for a 'resurrection' , even if a patient has been declared dead (ie: brain dead) is that the initial diagnosis was incorrect ?
17 Mar 05
Originally posted by AThousandYoung
So when it's said that Jesus was resurrected, you think it was the same thing as when a doctor declares someone dead but they come back to life? I can buy that, sure. There's nothing supernatural or amazing about that.
No indeed I believe Jesus was 'dead' in the traditional way. He was preaching for 3 days to the dead. See Isaiah.
Nope, I'm merely trying to contemplate what is considered a ressurection. IE: Say someone is declared brain dead, but we devise a method whereby that person could be brought back to live, would it only be a miracle if we didn't understand the process ?
17 Mar 05
Originally posted by pcaspianSay someone is declared brain dead, but we devise a method whereby that person could be brought back to live, would it only be a miracle if we didn't understand the process ?
Originally posted by AThousandYoung
[b]So when it's said that Jesus was resurrected, you think it was the same thing as when a doctor declares someone dead but they come back to life? I can buy that, sure. There's nothing supernatural or amazing about that.
No indeed I believe Jesus was 'dead' in the traditional way. He was preaching for ...[text shortened]... ould be brought back to live, would it only be a miracle if we didn't understand the process ? [/b]
I think that religious people would label it a miracle if scientists could not explain how it happened.
17 Mar 05
Originally posted by DarfiusPerhaps you would be kind enough to tell me who has died and come back to life?
"Nobody who has died has come back to life."
Let me guess, you are going to say 'Jesus'!
By definition, if he 'came back to life' then he wasn't dead! Perhaps simply 'stunned' like Monty Python's parrot.
19 Jun 05
Originally posted by pcaspianAnd if a Christian like you dies without having first given your material possessions to the poor, as Jesus commanded you to do, you too will spend eternity in Hell, alongside the atheists--if the Bible is true.
... Not only are they going to die, but a horrible future awaits them. In that respect I do feel empathy for a athiests at RHP...
19 Jun 05
Originally posted by DarfiusBeing in the medical field I can say with some confidence that no brain activity = dead (assuming no medical intervention). With medical intervention it's a different story. I have watched countless religious types with life ending illnesses pray for recovery. They have all ended up the same way, dead.
You should research that. Right now you sound rather ignorant.