Christian perfection in James

@Rajk999

It is interesting that Jesus never once used the term "relationship" so your expression 'perfection in relationship' is an unbiblical church doctrine designed to steer church goers into the wrong direction and away from the true teachings of Christ.

Concerning after His resurrection -

"In that day you will know that I am in My Father, and you in Me, and I in you." (John 14:20)

The word "relationship" may not appear in that sentence. But surely it is a very intimate and involved relationship between God and His saved people.

It is in fact a mutual indwelling of the triune God in man and man in the triune God. It is a mingling of God and man.

How can anyone say no "relationship" is indicated there?

@secondson said
If it makes you happy not to have a relationship with God, then by all means work your way home.

These jokers here also thought they had a relationship with Christ

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. (Matthew 7:21-23 KJV)

They, like you, failed to understand, what Jesus preached. They thought Jesus was interested in professing to know him and in using the Holy Spirit to cast out devils and do miracles. But that is not good works.

He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. (John 14:21 KJV)

You got that church boy? Jesus said that those who keep the commandments, those are the ones that love Him, and in return God loves those who keep the commandments.

So your relationship with Christ is only in your head.

@sonship said
@Rajk999

It is interesting that Jesus never once used the term "relationship" so your expression 'perfection in relationship' is an unbiblical church doctrine designed to steer church goers into the wrong direction and away from the true teachings of Christ.

Concerning after His resurrection -

[quote] [b] "In that day you will know that I am in My ...[text shortened]... God. It is a mingling of God and man.

How can anyone say no "relationship" is indicated there?

You are full of baloney sonship. Your doctrine is evil and Satanic. In the very next verse Jesus explains what He means, but you omit it so that you can peddle your nonsense.

At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you. He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. (John 14:20-21 KJV)

A relationship with Christ comes from KEEPING THE COMMANDMENTS.

At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you. He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. (John 14:20-21 KJV)

A relationship with Christ comes from KEEPING THE COMMANDMENTS.

Verse 20 is about God coming in Christ into man and putting man into God in Himself.

Verse 21 is about Christ manifesting Himself more and more to the ones who have been brought into this mutual indwelling.

The only command of Christ the disciples really obeyed in John 20 was to believe that Jesus the Lord had raised from the dead. They came together in brotherly love, and Christ imparted into them the Holy Spirit.

" ... the disciples rejoiced at seeing the Lord. (20:20b)

Then Jesus said to them again, Peace be to you; as the Father has sent Me, I also send you. (v.21)

And when He had said this, He breathed into them and said to them, Receive the Holy Spirit." (v.22)

He is God as a man. He put Himself into them as the life giving Spirit. They commenced on knowing that He was in the Father and they were in Him and He was in them.

Over the rest of their lives as they learned to live by obeying and following Him inwardly, He more more manifested Himself to them.

The only commandments obeyed that seemed start the relationship were:

1.) They believed in the risen Lord Jesus.

2.) They received the Holy Spirit.

The Holy Spirit is the Lord Himself in another form as the Spirit -

"And the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is there is freedom." (2 Cor. 3:17)

@sonship said

At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you. He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. (John 14:20-21 KJV)

A relationship with Christ comes from KEEPING THE COMMANDMENTS.

Verse 20 is ab ...[text shortened]... rd is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is there is freedom." (2 Cor. 3:17) [/b] [/quote]

More Satanic lies. I really cannot believe that the church has gone so far astray as to preach that utter garbage. The core commandment of Jesus was kept and practiced in the early church. The core teaching that leads to perfection is selling all you have and giving to the poor.

And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers. And fear came upon every soul: and many wonders and signs were done by the apostles. And all that believed were together, and had all things common; And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need. (Acts 2:42-45 KJV)

Ananias and Sapphira tried to pretend that they were doing this but clearly their heart was not with God and they were killed. You are going to face the same fate for lying to the Holy Spirit and to God with your preaching that the Apostles did not follow any commandments. LIAR !!

@rajk999 said
A relationship with Christ comes from KEEPING THE COMMANDMENTS.

So now you're saying there is "a relationship with Christ".

And you think it "comes from" "KEEPING THE COMMANDMENTS."

But the scriptures say "all have sinned", that "none are righteous"(read Romans chapter 3), and that "...a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified." (Galatians 2:16)

Clearly, a man is not justified except "by the faith of Jesus Christ", that when "we have believed in Jesus Christ" are we then "justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law".


To have a relationship with Jesus one must be "justified", and to be justified one must "believe in Jesus Christ".

One cannot be justified by KEEPING THE COMMANDMENTS, but only by the "faith of Jesus Christ".

All of that is clearly explained in Romans 3 and Galatians 2.

Your intellectual and spiritual issue is your inability to reconcile the words of Jesus with the gospel of grace revealed to the apostle Paul.

You poor man. Wake up.

@rajk999 said
your preaching that the Apostles did not follow any commandments.

You're allowing your unregenerate imagination to get the best of you, and you're projecting an unwarranted bias.

No one posting in this forum has ever said that "the apostles did not follow any commandments."

And no one posting in this forum has ever said that a Christian shouldn't keep the law.

Your mind is trapped by your illusions. Your accusations are false, and your understanding of scripture is fundamentally flawed.

@secondson said
You're allowing your unregenerate imagination to get the best of you, and you're projecting an unwarranted bias.

No one posting in this forum has ever said that "the apostles did not follow any commandments."

And no one posting in this forum has ever said that a Christian shouldn't keep the law.

Your mind is trapped by your illusions. Your accusations are false, and your understanding of scripture is fundamentally flawed.

Ok Mr. Perfection in Relationship. lol 😀

@rajk999 said
Ok Mr. Perfection in Relationship. lol 😀

It's "perfection of relationship".

Not a concept you're acquainted with. It is about relating to God as father through faith in Jesus His Son, and not through the law by the performance of works.

@SecondSon

You're allowing your unregenerate imagination to get the best of you, and you're projecting an unwarranted bias.

I think it is more like not just "allowing" but being enslaved to it, TRAPPED in it.

No one posting in this forum has ever said that "the apostles did not follow any commandments."

I am in full agreement. One entire thread could be dedicated to Rajk999 offering examples of his many accusations. I think it would be mostly EMPTY.

They are mostly groundless charges only.

And no one posting in this forum has ever said that a Christian shouldn't keep the law.

I may have argued about keeping of Christ as the law of life instead of keeping the law of Moses.

Your mind is trapped by your illusions. Your accusations are false, and your understanding of scripture is fundamentally flawed.

I am about to do a thread on FOUR major things which if misunderstood lead to this kind of mistaken and off perversion of the New Testament.

Watch for it.

@rajk999 said
It is interesting that Jesus never once used the term "relationship" so your expression 'perfection in relationship' is an unbiblical church doctrine designed to steer church goers into the wrong direction and away from the true teachings of Christ.

And church people love it. They love to hear your doctrine of do nothing, help nobody, just pray, attend church, give the p ...[text shortened]... d works is the road to perfection.

Your doctrine about perfection in relationship is foolishness.

When the scripture say examine ourselves if we are in the faith, what is it asking?
Since you have not answered, I'll give it too you. When the scripture tells us this, is this something you have to agree with and see the truth in it, or is it one of the scriptures you feel the need to ignore for some reason?

2 Corinthians 13:5
Look closely at yourselves. Test yourselves to see if you are living in the faith. Don’t you realize that Christ Jesus is in you? Of course, if you fail the test, he is not in you.

@secondson said
It's "perfection of relationship".

Not a concept you're acquainted with. It is about relating to God as father through faith in Jesus His Son, and not through the law by the performance of works.

Its not in the bible. Therefore is Satanic.
What you people have is a personal relationship with Satan.
Enjoy

@rajk999 said
Its not in the bible. Therefore is Satanic.
What you people have is a personal relationship with Satan.
Enjoy

Did you ever read?
"Don’t you realize that Christ Jesus is in you? Of course, if you fail the test, he is not in you."

@rajk999 said
Its not in the bible. Therefore is Satanic.
What you people have is a personal relationship with Satan.
Enjoy

So what you're saying is that father and son isn't a relationship.

You're a troll for not recognizing that God created man to be in fellowship with Him.

You're a blind troll for not recognizing and acknowledging that the scriptures teach that man, in Christ, is in fellowship with God through Christ, and that the believer is made a member of God's family, which is all about relationships with both God and fellow believers.

You're unbelievably ignorant.