08 Jul 08
Originally posted by Rajk999Jesus rewarded those non-jews who recognized their position at that time. They understood that the blessings came through Israel. Notice how they acknowledge Israel's special position.
I thought you said Christ came to the Jews and preached only to the Jews. He preached to the Samaritans also.
Luke 7:1-10
(1) Now when he had ended all his sayings in the audience of the people, he entered into Capernaum.
(2) And a certain centurion's servant, who was dear unto him, was sick, and ready to die.
(3) And when he heard of Jesus, he sent unto him the elders of the Jews, beseeching him that he would come and heal his servant.
(4) And when they came to Jesus, they besought him instantly, saying, That he was worthy for whom he should do this:
(5) For he loveth our nation, and he hath built us a synagogue.
(6) Then Jesus went with them. And when he was now not far from the house, the centurion sent friends to him, saying unto him, Lord, trouble not thyself: for I am not worthy that thou shouldest enter under my roof:
(7) Wherefore neither thought I myself worthy to come unto thee: but say in a word, and my servant shall be healed.
(8) For I also am a man set under authority, having under me soldiers, and I say unto one, Go, and he goeth; and to another, Come, and he cometh; and to my servant, Do this, and he doeth it.
(9) When Jesus heard these things, he marvelled at him, and turned him about, and said unto the people that followed him, I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel.
(10) And they that were sent, returning to the house, found the servant whole that had been sick.
Matthew 15:22-28
(22) And, behold, a woman of Canaan came out of the same coasts, and cried unto him, saying, Have mercy on me, O Lord, thou Son of David; my daughter is grievously vexed with a devil.
(23) But he answered her not a word. And his disciples came and besought him, saying, Send her away; for she crieth after us.
(24) But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
(25) Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me.
(26) But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs.
(27) And she said, Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table.
(28) Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.
Isaiah 2:1-4
Psalms 128:1-6
His goal at that time obviously was to bring salvation to Israel.
08 Jul 08
Originally posted by Rajk999Yep. Now, for a full understanding of the parable, understand God as the Samaritan in the parable. That is the way God does it. “Go and do likewise.”
Where do you get these totally nonsensical statements from ? What about the Good Samaritan ? Was he saved ? Did he want something in return ? Christ said to GO AND DO WHAT THE GOOD SAMARITAN DID .... READ IT.
THE QUESTION WAS : HOW DO I GET ETERNAL LIFE ?
THE ANSWER WAS : DO LIKE THE GOOD SAMARITAN.
Luke 10 25 And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up ...[text shortened]... he said, He that showed mercy on him. Then said Jesus unto him, [b]Go, and do thou likewise.[/b]
Who is my neighbor?
Who was a neighbor to him who fell among the thieves?
Go and do likewise...
What did God [the Samaritan] require of the man who was half-dead, in order to “save” him?
Nada.
Go and do likewise...
Did God [the Samaritan] say, “Believe in me, and I’ll save you”? “Repent and I’ll save you”? No.
Go and do likewise...
Do you think that people want a God who behaves like the Samaritan in the story? Hear their objections. Then—
Go and do...
Do they say that you won’t earn salvation that way?
Go and do...
So those that cry, “Lord, Lord” are the ones that are saved?
Go and do, anyway...
What do they think God wants: those who “believe”, who cry “lord, lord”? Or those that simply “go and do likewise...”? Do they think that—after Jesus tells that parable—that God will still hold as damned those who just “go and do likewise”?
Jesus says, “Go and do likewise...”—to inherit eternal life.
How?
I am reminded of my Tai Chi master. There was a movement where one had to simply step straight out to the left. Students were unused to body kinesthetics, and their (our) feet would end up all over the place. The master kept saying: “Step straight out to the left.” There is no “how” for such a thing. Nevertheless, one of the students, in frustration, asked: “How does one step straight out to the left!?!” The master said: “Step straight out to the left.” That was his answer; what else was he to say?
How? Go and do likewise...
08 Jul 08
Originally posted by SmoothCowboySo lets see. Christ came to the Jews only. The Jews took Him and nailed Him to the cross and to this day, they dont believe He ever came. So Christ's mission was a failure, except for the fact that he died on the cross. Do I have it right now?
Jesus rewarded those non-jews who recognized their position at that time. They understood that the blessings came through Israel. Notice how they acknowledge Israel's special position.
Luke 7:1-10
(1) Now when he had ended all his sayings in the audience of the people, he entered into Capernaum.
(2) And a certain centurion's servant, who was dear ...[text shortened]... 2:1-4
Psalms 128:1-6
His goal at that time obviously was to bring salvation to Israel.
08 Jul 08
Originally posted by vistesdVistesd! Welcome Back. Always good to have you in this discussions.
Yep. Now, for a full understanding of the parable, understand God as the Samaritan in the parable. That is the way God does it. “Go and do likewise.”
Who is my neighbor?
Who was a neighbor to him who fell among the thieves?
Go and do likewise...
What did God [the Samaritan] require of the man who was half-dead, in order to “save” him? ...[text shortened]... out to the left.” That was his answer; what else was he to say?
How? Go and do likewise...
Thats a bit different from the last interpretation of this parable since we last spoke. But it applies well.
Are you saying that this parable seems to be saying that 'knowing Christ' the way Christian's do or claim to do is not important?
All we need to do is "Go and Do Likewise"?
08 Jul 08
Originally posted by Rajk999My interpretation is that we should "Go and Do Likewise" because it is right not because we want salvation. And it is 'right' because it leads to a better world - again, not because of some perceived benefit after death.
Are you saying that this parable seems to be saying that 'knowing Christ' the way Christian's do or claim to do is not important?
All we need to do is "Go and Do Likewise"?
The 'Go and do likewise' teachings of Jesus, raise an important question. If suffering is brought on by God, or in some way necessary, or at a minimum not preventable by God, then why does he want us to try to prevent or minimize it? It looks as if we are either working against God, or we are doing something he is incapable of doing.
08 Jul 08
Originally posted by vistesdI think in that parable the Good Samaritan represents Jesus.
Yep. Now, for a full understanding of the parable, understand God as the Samaritan in the parable. That is the way God does it. “Go and do likewise.”
Who is my neighbor?
Who was a neighbor to him who fell among the thieves?
Go and do likewise...
What did God [the Samaritan] require of the man who was half-dead, in order to “save” him? ...[text shortened]... out to the left.” That was his answer; what else was he to say?
How? Go and do likewise...
08 Jul 08
Originally posted by Rajk999Vistesd! Welcome Back. Always good to have you in this discussions.
Vistesd! Welcome Back. Always good to have you in this discussions.
Thats a bit different from the last interpretation of this parable since we last spoke. But it applies well.
Are you saying that this parable seems to be saying that 'knowing Christ' the way Christian's do or claim to do is not important?
All we need to do is "Go and Do Likewise"?
Thank you.
Yeah, the interpretation is a bit different. Jaywill’s view is also valid. I could also say that the Samaritan represents how God’s logos works in the world (relating it to the sun that shines on good and bad alike, etc.) for soterias (healing/salvation). Most such stories/parables are multi-faceted.
I am beginning to think that this whole grace versus works stuff is a false dichotomy. If Jesus’ message of salvation were really that simple, “one-size-fits-all”, he just could’ve made one unambiguous statement and then repeat it ad infinitum. Instead, he addressed different people differently—from where they were, and what they individually needed to hear, not from where he was. Like any good Pastor, he spoke differently to individuals than to large crowds.
When we read the Biblical texts, we stand as those different individuals—and as different ourselves, with different needs, from day to day. Some days we just need to hear some grace; some days we need a work-assignment.
Part of my new “spin” on that parable is “Don’t worry about it.”
11 Jul 08
Originally posted by Rajk999You are almost right. He came and offered them the kingdom. They rejected Him. Then He sent the Holy Ghost to minister to them and they rejected Him. The Jews as a nation rejected God, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost.
So lets see. Christ came to the Jews only. The Jews took Him and nailed Him to the cross and to this day, they dont believe He ever came. So Christ's mission was a failure, except for the fact that he died on the cross. Do I have it right now?
Mat 12:31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
Matthew 21:33-43
(33) Hear another parable: There was a certain householder, which planted a vineyard, and hedged it round about, and digged a winepress in it, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country:
(34) And when the time of the fruit drew near, he sent his servants to the husbandmen, that they might receive the fruits of it.
(35) And the husbandmen took his servants, and beat one, and killed another, and stoned another.
(36) Again, he sent other servants more than the first: and they did unto them likewise.
(37) But last of all he sent unto them his son, saying, They will reverence my son.
(38) But when the husbandmen saw the son, they said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and let us seize on his inheritance.
(39) And they caught him, and cast him out of the vineyard, and slew him.
(40) When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen?
(41) They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons.
(42) Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?
(43) Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.
Acts 2:16-23
(16) But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;
(17) And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
(18) And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:
(19) And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:
(20) The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:
(21) And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.
(22) Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:
(23) Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
Joel 2:28-32
(28) And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:
(29) And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit.
(30) And I will shew wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke.
(31) The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come.
(32) And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the LORD hath said, and in the remnant whom the LORD shall call.