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Originally posted by @divegeesterUndeniable proof right there. You have (me) cornered. 🙄
Quite a coincidence; no posts from you for 3 or more days and suddenly, within a few politely spaced hours of me mentioning you to Romans1009, lo and behold, here you are...and posting about me and alcohol...just like Romans1009’s little catch phrases.
Your card is well and truly marked sonny.
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Originally posted by @divegeesterQuite a coincidence that you accuse him of being me whenever he has you under the cosh?
Quite a coincidence; no posts from you for 3 or more days and suddenly, within a few politely spaced hours of me mentioning you to Romans1009, lo and behold, here you are...and posting about me and alcohol...just like Romans1009’s little catch phrases.
Your card is well and truly marked sonny.
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15 Apr 18
Originally posted by @dj2beckerWhere was that? 😵
Quite a coincidence that you accuse him of being me whenever he has you under the cosh?
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Originally posted by @dj2beckerYour card is well and truly marked Fetchmybecker
Undeniable proof right there. You have (me) cornered. 🙄
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Originally posted by @divegeesterWell at least myself and Romans are now fully aware of how poor your judgement really is.
Your card is well and truly marked Fetchmybecker
15 Apr 18
Originally posted by @ghost-of-a-dukeSo because there are metaphors and symbolism then it doesn't mean that there really is a judgment and punishment to come. Or that forever and ever doesn't mean forever and ever. Or that a record isn't being kept of the lives of every man, and that all men will be held accountable for what they did in this life.
You quote for example Revelation 20:13-15 (lake of fire) but your argument is self-defeating as you are referencing a part of the bible particularly rife with metaphor and symbolism. Surely you see that?
Because it's metaphorical and symbolic it doesn't mean what it says and is open to individual interpretation.
What freaks everyone out isn't so much the idea of punishment. What freaks out the unbeliever is the idea of accountability.
Now for you and I the idea of accountability isn't so intimidating, but for the mass murdering rapist thieving lying child molesting filth of this world it is of dire consequence.
But for you and I that worked hard, loved our wives and children and generally did the best we could with our lot, judgement may seem unfair and just a little too harsh.
This is the thing though, the standard is perfection. Unattainable in our present condition. We know we don't measure up to the biblical standard. A change in our condition needs to be made. God provided the way and means. Without any help from us.
Look at the whole of the picture. A short life in a lost and dying world. A chance to live forever in a reality that was originally meant to be. We need a saviour. Bottom line. The only solution to this pernicious drama of life and death placed before us.
We make the right choice now while we live because judgement is sure to come. It would be a greater tragedy if it didn't.
Originally posted by @secondsonActually what freaks out normal thinking people is that idea of tormenting someone in fire for ETERNITY. Do you know what eternity is?
So because there are metaphors and symbolism then it doesn't mean that there really is a judgment and punishment to come. Or that forever and ever doesn't mean forever and ever. Or that a record isn't being kept of the lives of every man, and that all men will be held accountable for what they did in this life.
Because it's metaphorical and symbolic i ...[text shortened]... now while we live because judgement is sure to come. It would be a greater tragedy if it didn't.
Say a man lives 70 yrs and commits the most horrendous acts of evil.. lets say he was like Hitler, Pol Pot, + the sickest child mosester in history, all rolled into one. That is because of 70 yrs of sin and evil God sees it fit to torment this man in eternal fire for zillions and zillions of years. And on and on without end. Normal thinking people know that God will not do that.
What is worse is that for someone to conclude that that doctrine is true they have to ignore all the parts of the bible that speaks of destruction and death for evil doers, and they have to force their thinking past what the Bible says and stick with eternal torment.
Further the worse kind of Christian is the one that goes beyond that and says that all people who are not Christians will experience this fate even children who do not know Christ.
The whole doctrine is sick. It was developed by depraved crooked church leaders, preached by sycophantic fools, and swallowed by morons. You fall somewhere in there as well.
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15 Apr 18
Originally posted by @dj2beckerWell there is that to be grateful for... 🙄
Well at least myself and Romans are now fully aware of how poor your judgement really is.
15 Apr 18
Originally posted by @rajk999I'm sure, since you're so spiritually astute, that you know exactly what eternity is.
Actually what freaks out normal thinking people is that idea of tormenting someone in fire for ETERNITY. Do you know what eternity is?
Say a man lives 70 yrs and commits the most horrendous acts of evil.. lets say he was like Hitler, Pol Pot, + the sickest child mosester in history, all rolled into one. That is because of 70 yrs of sin and evil God see ...[text shortened]... , preached by sycophantic fools, and swallowed by morons. You fall somewhere in there as well.
You think eternity has to do with the duration of time.
"...they have to force their thinking past what the Bible says..."
Perfect description of you.
15 Apr 18
Originally posted by @secondsonYou are very skilled in the art of talking without saying anything.
I'm sure, since you're so spiritually astute, that you know exactly what eternity is.
You think eternity has to do with the duration of time.
[b]"...they have to force their thinking past what the Bible says..."
Perfect description of you.[/b]
Common traits of politicians, preachers, insurance salesmen, bankers
... and other crooked occupations.
Keep it up.
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Originally posted by @secondsonMy point is, in a book like Revelation, full of metaphor and symbolism, how do you know what is factual and what is not intended to be taken literally?
So because there are metaphors and symbolism then it doesn't mean that there really is a judgment and punishment to come. Or that forever and ever doesn't mean forever and ever. Or that a record isn't being kept of the lives of every man, and that all men will be held accountable for what they did in this life.
Because it's metaphorical and symbolic i ...[text shortened]... now while we live because judgement is sure to come. It would be a greater tragedy if it didn't.
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Originally posted by @ghost-of-a-dukeGood point, but wrt the Bible, whose intentions are we talking about? The putative God’s intentions? The human author? Those who declared it to be part of the Canon? Once we open the door to such questions, uncertainty lurks.
My point is, in a book like Revelation, full of metaphor and symbolism, how do you know what is factual and what is not intended to be taken literally?
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Originally posted by @suzianneI'm sorry to hear you find the 'eternal torment' debate tiresome. Personally, I think eternal torment is a topic you need to debate more not less, in order to come to the realization how incongruous it is to the notion of an all-loving deity.
I notice that when so-called Christians don't have anything else to argue about, they bring out the tired old 'eternal torment' debate.
I mean when they're temporarily tired of assuming and judging and telling people what they should do, without feeling the slightest imperative to do it themselves.
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Originally posted by @divegeesterA better question would be 'where wasn't that?'
Where was that? 😵