New idea in electric cars: it rotates.

Originally posted by thyme
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_RAV4_EV

it says it "makes mileage in the RAV4EV the cost equivalent to a 111.1-mile-per-gallon small SUV (2.12 L/100 km)."

I have to compliment you on your estimating skills.

Apprently Ed Begly (resident in California) owns one of these.

WELL, if it's good enough for uncle Eddie.....
Any Euro's here? I just heard petrol is something like 9 bucks a gallon, Euro is what, 1.5 dollars, so 6 ish Euro's a gallon or about 2 euro's a liter? Is that right? Gad, even now the US is better off.

Originally posted by sonhouse
WELL, if it's good enough for uncle Eddie.....
Any Euro's here? I just heard petrol is something like 9 bucks a gallon, Euro is what, 1.5 dollars, so 6 ish Euro's a gallon or about 2 euro's a liter? Is that right? Gad, even now the US is better off.

Here in SA Petrol is about R9 a litre and rising. Thats R34 a gallon or US$4.50 a gallon.
In Zambia it is about twice that because they must transport it from the coast then add over 100% tax.

Originally posted by sonhouse
WELL, if it's good enough for uncle Eddie.....
Any Euro's here? I just heard petrol is something like 9 bucks a gallon, Euro is what, 1.5 dollars, so 6 ish Euro's a gallon or about 2 euro's a liter? Is that right? Gad, even now the US is better off.

1.6 to 1.67 Euro a liter. About 60% of that is tax.
Two weeks ago it was still 1.5 to 1.57 a liter. I don't know hat happened last week, did the Middle East explode? I must have missed it.

I 've got a bike.

Originally posted by thyme
1.6 to 1.67 Euro a liter. About 60% of that is tax.
Two weeks ago it was still 1.5 to 1.57 a liter. I don't know hat happened last week, did the Middle East explode? I must have missed it.

I 've got a bike.

You mean a bicycle? As opposed to some kind of Vespa. I wish I could get to work on a bike, it's way too dangerous on the little roads I have to take, bad roads, lots of construction permanently going on, start at one end, screw something up there, finish that, go on to the next screwup and so forth, a lifelong job for the road workers, good for them, not so good for the commuters. I would like to drive something like a vespa and get 100 mpg and such but my wife made me promise to give up motorcycles after our daughter was killed on one. It's a conundrum for sure.

Originally posted by sonhouse
You mean a bicycle? As opposed to some kind of Vespa. I wish I could get to work on a bike, it's way too dangerous on the little roads I have to take, bad roads, lots of construction permanently going on, start at one end, screw something up there, finish that, go on to the next screwup and so forth, a lifelong job for the road workers, good for them, not s ...[text shortened]... romise to give up motorcycles after our daughter was killed on one. It's a conundrum for sure.

I am sorry to hear about your daughter. Motorcycles have almost the same average fuel consumption as cars, I think? The difference is a bit too small considering their impracticalities, to make them very attractive substitute.

My bike is what you would call a pushbike. Vespas are for old ladies. That said, even my mother who is going on 75 rides a pushbike... I dare say people riding push bike reach old age in better health than people riding Vespas, so getting a Vespa might set some vicious old lady circle in motion. You won't catch me on one.

Where I work is too long a drive to go by bike so I use my car, but thanks to the internet I can work from home three days a week. For any distance under 20 km i will generally take the pushbike.

Our country is flat and closely populated. Nearly everywhere you will be able to find everything society can offer within a range of 20 km.

Originally posted by thyme

Our country is flat and closely populated. Nearly everywhere you will be able to find everything society can offer within a range of 20 km.

The Netherlands is the cyclist's Utopia. They say you can even fish them out of the canals. Bicycles, that is, not cyclists.

But countries with great distances have no excuse. Convert those multi-lane freeways with some sort of clip-on conveyor belt for bikes; leave two lanes in the middle for vehicles to come and go.

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
The Netherlands is the cyclist's Utopia. They say you can even fish them out of the canals. Bicycles, that is, not cyclists.

But countries with great distances have no excuse. Convert those multi-lane freeways with some sort of clip-on conveyor belt for bikes; leave two lanes in the middle for vehicles to come and go.

Well lets see, the US freeway system cost us about 500 billion or so, give or take a trillion🙂, but this kind of horizontal escalator, might be double that and I wonder how much energy it would take to run, for the whole US, gigawatts no doubt. I know, how bout each bicycle be strapped in place and they have to pedal and the wheel powers a little generator. Maybe that will make enough energy to run the system....

Originally posted by thyme
Motorcycles have almost the same average fuel consumption as cars, I think?

Not even close. A small motor cycle should get far more millage than a car. And even cars have significant differences depending on size. There is a reason why the Europeans drive such small cars you know.

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
But countries with great distances have no excuse.

There is no such thing as 'countries with great distances'. I suppose you mean countries in which you typically have to travel a long way to work.
I personally think the solution to that is better planning and encouraging people to live closer to where they work. I live 4 streets away from my office!
Also, nearly half the traffic on the roads in the morning is people taking their children to school. If the school bus system was better organized, and the locations of schools compared to peoples residences and work was well organized we could cut down a lot of that traffic. Part of the school problem is differing quality of schools so people don't just pick the nearest school they pick what they think is the best school within their budget.

Convert those multi-lane freeways with some sort of clip-on conveyor belt for bikes;
Its called a train. Something the world doesn't have enough of. They are far more efficient than other means of transport. I don't know if they allow bicycles on trains in SA.

Originally posted by twhitehead
There is no such thing as 'countries with great distances'. I suppose you mean countries in which you typically have to travel a long way to work.

Are you compulsively pedantic or do you do it for the kicks? I doubt anyone reading my post would have trouble understanding what I meant.

"Other European countries, including those which now have open universities, were slower to act [to provide distance education] than Canada and Australia, countries with great distances, which, like New Zealand, had developed correspondence education long before." http://uk.encarta.msn.com/encyclopedia_781530008/Distance_Learning.html

Good grief.

Originally posted by sonhouse
Well lets see, the US freeway system cost us about 500 billion or so, give or take a trillion🙂, but this kind of horizontal escalator, might be double that and I wonder how much energy it would take to run, for the whole US, gigawatts no doubt. I know, how bout each bicycle be strapped in place and they have to pedal and the wheel powers a little generator. Maybe that will make enough energy to run the system....

You've got a few million guys languishing in jail, maybe they could all chip in. Organic, labour-intensive methods are all the rage these days.

Originally posted by twhitehead

[b]Convert those multi-lane freeways with some sort of clip-on conveyor belt for bikes;
Its called a train. Something the world doesn't have enough of. They are far more efficient than other means of transport. I don't know if they allow bicycles on trains in SA.[/b]

Bicycles aren't allowed on trains, or trains would have to be allowed on bicycles.

I catch the train daily; there's a bit of a space issue, although we have been promised new trains.

Originally posted by twhitehead
Not even close. A small motor cycle should get far more millage than a car. And even cars have significant differences depending on size. There is a reason why the Europeans drive such small cars you know.

The fuel consumption of a motorcycle depends very much on how the rider uses it, fast accellerating mororcycles at the moment of accellerating consume far more than the average. Therefore the fuel consumption of a motorcycle with a powerful engine on average is comparable to a small car that is more sensibly driven. I agree that a motorcycle with a less powerful engine would consume less, but the ones that are on the market here are not that kind, and the people that drive them are not that type.

My car does 16 km per liter that would be about 38 miles per gallon.
My neighbours and I can park five cars in four spots http://kitkat.punt.nl/upload/08-05/tn_P5280008.JPG
Bicycles are allowed on trains outside rush hours.
There are bicycle lanes going from everywhere to everywhere.
It is a cyclists utopia, except for the weather.

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
Are you compulsively pedantic or do you do it for the kicks?

I am compulsively pedantic and will try to work on it.

However, the way the phrase is used in the quote you give is quite different from what you meant. Bicycle conveyor belts would not get someone from rural Australia or Canada to university. Ooops there I go again.

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
Bicycles aren't allowed on trains, or trains would have to be allowed on bicycles.

I catch the train daily; there's a bit of a space issue, although we have been promised new trains.

I guess it has to do with not having enough cyclists. My father was a life time member of the Cycle Touring Club and I remember articles in the magazine about campaigns to get certain trains to improve their facilities for bicycles.(in England)

I cycled to school for five years, but would hesitate to let my child do that here because of the traffic and crime. If there were proper cycle lanes etc a lot more people would cycle including me.