Car Race

Car Race

Posers and Puzzles

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u
The So Fist

Voice of Reason

Joined
28 Mar 06
Moves
9908
15 Jul 08

In how many ways, counting ties, can eight cars cross the finishing line?

(For example, two cars, A and B, can finish in three ways: A wins, B wins, A and B tie.)

h

Joined
25 Apr 06
Moves
5939
15 Jul 08

Originally posted by uzless
In how many ways, counting ties, can eight cars cross the finishing line?

(For example, two cars, A and B, can finish in three ways: A wins, B wins, A and B tie.)
This makes me think of horses.

h

Joined
25 Apr 06
Moves
5939
15 Jul 08

Originally posted by heinzkat
This makes me think of horses.
http://www.redhotpawn.com/board/showthread.php?subject=Horse_race&threadid=94066

u
The So Fist

Voice of Reason

Joined
28 Mar 06
Moves
9908
15 Jul 08

Originally posted by heinzkat
http://www.redhotpawn.com/board/showthread.php?subject=Horse_race&threadid=94066
Ya, but this one is about cars damn it!

F

Joined
11 Nov 05
Moves
43938
15 Jul 08

Originally posted by uzless
Ya, but this one is about cars damn it!
...with horse powers...

Insanity at Masada

tinyurl.com/mw7txe34

Joined
23 Aug 04
Moves
26660
18 Jul 08
1 edit

8! Different possibilities if no two cars pass at the same time. Added to that are all the different possible ties, including ties for 2nd, 3rd etc.

If it were only 3 cars, it'd be 3! = 6 plus the ties. There are 6 possible 2 way ties for 1st and 6 for 2nd. There is one possible three way tie. That's 19 possibilities.

4 cars, we have 4! = 10 plus the 4 way tie, 4 3 way ties, 4 1 way ties, and 12 2 way ties, each multiplied by all the positions they can be in...

This does not seem like an easy problem.

f
Defend the Universe

127.0.0.1

Joined
18 Dec 03
Moves
16687
18 Jul 08

The link to the "horse race" thread contains my attempted solution. Not sure if anyone has taken a deeper look at it...

u
The So Fist

Voice of Reason

Joined
28 Mar 06
Moves
9908
18 Jul 08

Originally posted by AThousandYoung
8! Different possibilities if no two cars pass at the same time. Added to that are all the different possible ties, including ties for 2nd, 3rd etc.

If it were only 3 cars, it'd be 3! = 6 plus the ties. There are 6 possible 2 way ties for 1st and 6 for 2nd. There is one possible three way tie. That's 19 possibilities.

4 cars, we have 4! = 10 ...[text shortened]... multiplied by all the positions they can be in...

This does not seem like an easy problem.
It indeed is no simple one. I didn't check to see the other threads answer, but if it doesn't start iwth 5 then it is wrong.

Insanity at Masada

tinyurl.com/mw7txe34

Joined
23 Aug 04
Moves
26660
19 Jul 08

Originally posted by forkedknight
The link to the "horse race" thread contains my attempted solution. Not sure if anyone has taken a deeper look at it...
[i]the Sum from i=1 to 8 of ( C(n, i) * P(n-i+1, n-i+1) )

*edit* where:
C(n, k) is the number of combinations of size k from a set of size n, and
P(n, r) is the number of permutations of size r from a set of size n

*edit 2*
and n = 8

*edit 3*
and this only accounts for cases where there is only one tie, but that tie can be between any or all of the horses, so it's not a complete solution...




this should be a complete answer....

from my previous answer:
for i = 1:
P(8,8) = 8!
for i = 2:
for 1 tie: C(8, 2) * P(7, 7) = 8!/(6!2!) * 7!
for 2 ties: C(8,2) * C(6,2) * P(6,6) = 8!/(6!2!) * 6!/(4!2!) * 6!
for 3 ties: C(8,2) * C(6,2) * C(4,2) * P(5,5) = " * " * 4!/4 * 5!
for 4 ties: C(8,2) * C(6,2) * C(4,2) * C(2,2) * P(4,4) = " * " * " * 2 * 4!
for i = 3:
for 1 tie: C(8,3) * P(6,6) = 8!/(5!3!) * 6!
for 2 ties: C(8,3) * C(5,3) * P(4,4) = 8!/(5!3!) * 5!/(3!2!) * 4!
for i = 4:
for 1 ties C(8,4) * P(5,5) = 8!/(4!4!) * 5!
for 2 ties C(8,4) * C(4,4) * P(2,2) = 8!/(4!4!) * 1 * 2
for i = 5:
only 1 tie possible: C(8,5) * P(4,4) = 8!/(3!5!) * 4!
for i = 6:
" " " ": C(8,6) * P(3,3) = 8!/(6!2!) * 6
for i = 7:
" " " ": C(8,7) * P(2,2) = 16
for i = 8: 1

Therefore, the total is:
1 + 16 + 8!/(6!2!) * 6 + 8!/(3!5!) * 4! + 8!/(4!4!) * 5 * 2 +

8!/(4!4!) * 5! + 8!/(5!3!) * 5!/(3!2!) * 4! + 8!/(5!3!) * 6! +

8!/(6!2!) * 6!/(5!2!) * 4!/4 * 2 * 4! +

8!/(6!2!) * 6!/(4!2!) * 4!/4 * 5! +

8!/(6!2!) * 6!/(4!2!) * 6! + 8!/(6!2!) * 7! + 8!

*edit* fixed errors

Thread 94066

g

Joined
15 Feb 07
Moves
667
19 Jul 08

OK, I have an answer for this one, but first the approach.

The possibility of ties in any number of ways complicates calculations greatly, and so the first step is to list all possible kinds of car groupings first, where a "group" of cars are all the cars that tied for a particular position. The actual position tied for does not matter at this point, but will be considered later.

No ties is one possibility, while an eight-way tie is the opposite possibility. A three-way tie and a two-way tie is also a possibility.

After these are listed out, I then consider each one separately, counting the total number of ways the cars could be grouped and multiplying it by the number of orders the groups could finish, and accounting for duplications based on several groups being the same size.

After calaculating this for every possible scenario, I then add up the number of possibilities.

My answer was 545,835 ways broken down like this.

* 8-way tie - 1
* 7-way tie - 16
* 6-way tie and 2-way tie - 56
* 6-way tie - 168
* 5-way tie and 3-way tie - 112
* 5-way tie and 2-way tie - 1,008
* 5-way tie - 1,344
* 2 4-way ties - 70
* 4-way tie and 3-way tie - 1,680
* 4-way tie and 2 2-way ties - 1,260
* 4-way tie and 2-way tie - 10,080
* 4-way tie - 8,400
* 2 3-way ties and 2-way tie - 1,680
* 2 3-way ties - 6,720
* 3-way tie and 2 2-way ties - 20,160
* 3-way tie and 2-way tie - 67,200
* 3-way tie - 40,320
* 4 2-way ties - 2,520
* 3 2-way ties - 50,400
* 2 2-way ties - 151,200
* 2-way tie - 141,120
* No ties - 40,320

GRAND TOTAL - 545,835 ways to finish..

Feel free to analyze and correct any mistakes above.