At least 160 children died digging tunnels for Hamas

Originally posted by finnegan
I don't think people should be insulted when they have left school at the earliest age when they are legally permitted to leave, typically with limited if any academic qualifications. In any event, countless people remedy that educational deficit in other ways. (Countless people otherwise do no such thing and proclaim their inner wisdom is sufficient as an ...[text shortened]... ey need.

So all in all, there is a risk of arrogance, but lack of education is a disability.

If anyone believes they understand all the problems in the middle east they are seriously deluded.

Originally posted by redbadger
If anyone believes they understand all the problems in the middle east they are seriously deluded.

I agree. You have to keep checking out claims and counter claims and trust nobody, suspect everybody.

Originally posted by wolfgang59
"crossing the 0 mark in 1940" what the hell does that mean?

As to "getting our story straight" I don't need to confer with anyone.
My reply of 1 or 2 degrees was off the top of my head based on what I have
read through the years. To say that I am exaggerating by 2 or 4 times is
ridiculous - the figures are of the same degree of magnitude - and I
don't know what they relate to. Do you?

I think you came into the debate part way through wolfgang, and that has been the source of the miscommunication.

I'll re-cap for you: It's not even a debate I just asked a question. "What should the temperature be if not for man? If man had never learnt to light a fire or any of the other millions of developments that we all know and enjoy i.e. what would the temperature be if man never went beyond dumb beast and billions of lives had not been lived?

The response from Robbie, zahlanzi and Mr Self Righteous Indignation was ridicule, insults and evasion. Amongst all that Mr Self Righteous Indignation posted a link. It did not give the temperature in question, it did have a graph with a 0 line on it and a bunch of squiggly coloured lines rising from about 1940 to present to the amount of about .5 of a degree. .5 degree rise in 70 years. This is why I asked about your prediction of 1 to 2 degrees.

Would it be your conjecture that the temperature should be in a downward trend if not for man? Thus the temperature should be .5 to 1.5 degrees lower than what it was 70 years ago? Is that your position?

You'd like to make fun of my academic record, no worries, I have lived a practical life and I will relate an analogy here.

Occasionally we had to make repairs on ships that docked at our local port. Let's say that a hatch cover has been bent. The first thing you would need to ascertain is how bent it is. It's no good just saying the hatch cover is bent, right. This I parallel to Robbie, zahalanzi and Finnegan saying the temperature has gone up but not being able to say how much higher than what it would have been if man had remained about as advanced as a cow. These guys would be absolutely no use in a practical situation but they sure can spin some shyyte.

Originally posted by Wajoma
The direct question was: What should the temperature be if not for man's influence.

Judging by what we know about the climate, approximately between 0 and 1 °C lower.

Originally posted by finnegan
I agree. You have to keep checking out claims and counter claims and trust nobody, suspect everybody.

But those on the side of the Palestinians, in your case. The Palestinians could claim the tunnels in Gaza are just for irrigation of the land and the rockets or just fireworks to celebrate some holiday or something and you would believe it.