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  1. Standard memberno1marauder
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    20 Apr '24 16:31
    @averagejoe1 removed their quoted post
    I'm going to ignore posts from people who can't grasp what I just wrote and the excerpts from the Court's ruling.

    Nothing remotely in my post says Trump isn't charged with a felony in NY. In fact, he is charged with 34 counts of one: NY Penal Law § 175.10.
  2. Subscribermoonbus
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    20 Apr '24 17:19
    @no1marauder

    Thanks. I await with baited breath further updates in the case.
  3. Standard memberno1marauder
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    20 Apr '24 18:06
    @averagejoe1 said
    I, AvJoe, deleted something I mistyped. Let me now file my own Issues of the NY Trial. Then all of us are free to choose. You libs have not yet taken our freedom yet, I hope. Read this, and then read Maruder's Link-style post again.

    https://www.foxnews.com/media/trump-hush-money-trial-frankenstein-case-zapped-life-turley
    From your link:

    "And to this day, there's some confusion as to Bragg's actual theory as to what was the exact crime that Trump was hiding from all of this."

    Only if you have failed to read Judge Merchan's decision of February 15, 2015 that I have already cited. One would think that even a Fox News, Trump mouthpiece like Jonathan Turley would have at least done that.
  4. Subscribermoonbus
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    20 Apr '24 18:521 edit
    @no1marauder said
    Opening statements Monday. Jury selection went pretty smoothly considering the notoriety of the case.
    It's less the case that's "notorious" (falsifying business records isn't all that uncommon), it's more the defendant. It's hard for Trump to accept that, as far as the court is concerned, he's not a former president and not the presumptive front runner for the presidency either -- he's John Doe, just plain John Doe.

    Am I correct that this being a criminal case and not a civil one, the rules of evidence are tighter (i.e., tougher to get a conviction)?

    May cool and level heads prevail.
  5. Standard memberno1marauder
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    20 Apr '24 21:00
    @averagejoe1 said
    With my every post, I have this underlying '"How can these people stand behind Joe Biden for 4 more years, where they fully know that the WH is run 90% by people in their 20s, with big plans to socialize the United States of America."" That would be all of our left posters; They fallow the mantra of Kamala Harris. ".....just as long as, at the end of the day, we all end up in the same place'.

    Should not one strive to have their own place?
    Why don't you make your "own place" in a thread where such drivel is actually on-topic?
  6. Standard memberspruce112358
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    20 Apr '24 21:02
    There. We've condemned everything bad you can think of including pedophila, misogyny, putting trash in the recycle bin, and cruising in the passing lane.

    So you can't use that one anymore, AverageJoe!
  7. Standard memberno1marauder
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    20 Apr '24 21:03
    @moonbus said
    It's less the case that's "notorious" (falsifying business records isn't all that uncommon), it's more the defendant. It's hard for Trump to accept that, as far as the court is concerned, he's not a former president and not the presumptive front runner for the presidency either -- he's John Doe, just plain John Doe.

    Am I correct that this being a criminal case and not a ci ...[text shortened]... es of evidence are tighter (i.e., tougher to get a conviction)?

    May cool and level heads prevail.
    The rules of evidence are basically the same with some exceptions, most notably in what a defendant can be questioned about if he takes the stand (no matter what he says, Trump won't).

    The standard for a conviction is, of course, higher than that for a finding of civil liability being "beyond a reasonable doubt" rather than a "preponderance of evidence".
  8. Subscribervenda
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    21 Apr '24 11:31
    @anglian said
    Vespin's only whingeing because he thought by sandbagging 150 points from challenges effectively completed in 2023 he'd be home clear by the end of Jan 😉

    It's no fun is it @Vespin when for 11 months of the year your playing for nothing ..... and you can be certain by Feb 2025 I'll be one step ahead of you again 🍾
    The clan system will get worse.
    The reasons haven't changed.
    Clan leaders find it too much work to find challenges but the main problem is the clan net points list.
    Until the focus changes,the number of active clans will decrease.
    I've suggested ways to alter things but nothing happens.
  9. Standard memberspruce112358
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    22 Apr '24 00:41
    @averagejoe1 said
    Are you saying that the Biden administration has not weaponized the DOJ and FBI!?!?!?
    Yes. They have not.
  10. Subscribershavixmir
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    22 Apr '24 07:11
    Libertarians are just people who can’t spell librarian.
  11. Joined
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    22 Apr '24 07:20
    @wajoma said
    So this guy that set himself alight, you're sticking with your story he was a Trump supporter?

    divegeeter:

    "One less Trump supporting loon I suppose."
    You’re gonna disappoint me and tell me he was a socialist loon who just hated the Fat Orange Jesus so much that he decided the only way to express his views was to light up a fart and it all went horribly wrong?
  12. Subscriberkmax87
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    22 Apr '24 15:55
    @moonbus said
    Ich stimme zu.

    The correct thread title would have been 'is this MAGA's nadir?'

    To which the correct answer would have been, 'you ain't seen nuthin' yet!'
    Or the best is yet to come.
  13. Subscribermoonbus
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    23 Apr '24 06:59
    More frivolous litigation by Republican'ts, attempting to cast doubt on voting machines:


    https://edition.cnn.com/2024/04/22/politics/kari-lake-arizona-republican-supreme-court/index.html


    The SCOTUS dismissed the case without comment. Bravo. Let's look at real crime, not waste the court's time on unfounded conspiracy theories.
  14. Subscribershavixmir
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    23 Apr '24 11:59
    @mott-the-hoople said
    what do you think should be done about the 17 officials that lied about Trump on Russia collusion?

    Or about Clinton creating the fake Russia dossier?

    Or the officials that lied about hunters laptop?
    They should be given medals just to piss you off.
  15. Joined
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    23 Apr '24 17:56
    Former president Donald Trump is now on trial in a Manhattan courtroom, where facts are paramount, and a jury will assess the evidence and render a verdict. But as he enters and leaves that courtroom, Trump often stops before the cameras and blasts falsehoods to the court of public opinion, which can apply a different standard to Trump when it comes to facts. Here’s a quick assessment of several claims he made after the conclusion of the first day of testimony in his hush money trial, in the order in which he made them.

    “This is a case where you pay a lawyer, he’s a lawyer, and they call it a legal expense. That’s the exact term they use, legal expenses, in the books. And another thing that wasn’t even said was, we never even deducted it as a tax deduction.”

    Legal fees are often tax deductible. The fact that the Trump Organization did not take a tax deduction for the hush money payments is a possible red flag that these payments were handled improperly. Trump generally has taken as many tax deductions as possible. For instance, the Donald J. Trump Foundation — which Trump shut down after allegations he used it for his personal and political benefit — recorded a $7 foundation gift to the Boy Scouts. That matched the amount required to enroll a boy in the Scouts the year his son Donald Trump Jr. was 11.

    Michael “Cohen is a lawyer, represented a lot of people over the years. I’m not the only one, and he wasn’t very good in a lot of ways in terms of misrepresentation.”

    Trump now knocks his former attorney, Michael Cohen, who is expected to testify that he arranged the hush money payments at Trump’s behest, as not “very good.” That raises the question of why Cohen ended up working for Trump for 12 years, including 10 as vice president of the Trump Organization and then as Trump’s personal attorney after Trump was elected president.

    “He [Cohen] got in trouble for things that had nothing to do with me.”

    This is false. Cohen pleaded guilty to eight criminal charges, including two — “causing an unlawful corporate contribution” and “making an excessive campaign contribution” — that directly relate to the hush money case now being litigated in Manhattan criminal court. The charges laid out how “Individual-1” (Trump) began a presidential campaign in 2016 and how Cohen worked with the National Enquirer to squelch potentially damaging stories about alleged affairs with adult-film star Stormy Daniels and former Playboy model Karen McDougal. His payoffs were reimbursed by the Trump Organization.

    “Cohen caused and made the payments described herein in order to influence the 2016 presidential election,” the Justice Department said in a 2018 news release. “In so doing, he coordinated with one or more members of the campaign, including through meetings and phone calls, about the fact, nature, and timing of the payments. As a result of the payments solicited and made by Cohen, neither Woman-1 nor Woman-2 spoke to the press prior to the election.”

    Notably, this case was prosecuted when Trump was president. Geoffrey Berman, at the time the U.S. attorney for the Southern District of New York, revealed in 2022 that senior DOJ officials tried to remove all references to Trump. In the end, a compromise was made to water down the language, specifically to remove references to the idea that Trump acted “in concert with” and “coordinated with” Cohen to make illegal campaign contributions.

    “The other thing is: If this were such a great case, why didn’t the Southern District [of New York] bring it, who looked at it and turned it down?”

    In his memoir, “Holding the Line,” Berman says the case ended under pressure from Attorney General William P. Barr. The office, with Cohen’s cooperation in hand, began to investigate whether others should be charged in the hush money case. After Barr became attorney general in 2019, he ordered a review of the Cohen case, suggesting that the campaign finance charges be reversed — even though Cohen had pleaded guilty six months before. Specifically, he asked the Office of Legal Counsel to review whether there was a legal basis for the campaign finance changes. That froze any further investigation: “Not a single investigative step could be taken, not a single document in our possession could be reviewed until the issue was resolved,” Berman wrote, saying Barr’s intervention so long after a guilty plea was “highly unusual, if not unprecedented.” Barr eventually was convinced not to seek dismissal of the Cohen charges. But no additional charges were brought.

    “Very importantly, why didn’t the Federal Elections [Commission] do anything? Federal Elections took a total pass on it. They said essentially nothing was done wrong or they would have done something about it. They’re tough. … Actually, if you read their letter, they couldn’t even believe it. They were incredulous.”

    This is false. The Federal Election Commission staff, in a December 2020 report by the general counsel, said it had found “reason to believe” violations of campaign finance law were made “knowingly and willfully” by the Trump campaign. The report said that Cohen’s $130,000 payment to Daniels was far in excess of the legal limit for individual contributions of $2,700. “The available information indicates that Michael Cohen paid Stephanie Clifford [Daniels’s real name] $130,000 at the direction of 2016 presidential candidate Donald J. Trump, with Trump’s express promise of repayment, for the purpose of influencing the 2016 election,” the report said.
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