Spirituality
18 Aug 09
18 Aug 09
Originally posted by Bosse de NageWhat is the definition according to your dictionary? To speak with out-of-this-world people?
According to the dictionary definition of 'occult', Fundamentalist Protestants and traditionalist Catholics are occultists.
It's obvious, no?
18 Aug 09
Originally posted by FabianFnasThat may well be the case, given obvious exceptions. However, in my experience, Fundamentalists use 'occult' as a synonym for 'evil' and would be shocked to hear God referred to as an occult power.
According to that definition, all followers of any religion are occultists. Because religions have elements of supernatural phenomena.
For example, in his advice column, Billy Graham wrote, "There are supernatural or occult powers and forces at work in the world—forces that do not come from God but are actually opposed to Him."
18 Aug 09
Originally posted by Bosse de NageWell, let's ask the occultists themselves: According to wikipedia it is by the most practicing occultists "simply the study of a deeper spiritual reality that extends beyond pure reason and the physical sciences".
That may well be the case, given obvious exceptions. However, in my experience, Fundamentalists use 'occult' as a synonym for 'evil' and would be shocked to hear God referred to as an occult power.
For example, in his advice column, Billy Graham wrote, "There are supernatural or occult powers and forces at work in the world—forces that do not come from God but are actually opposed to Him."
Occultism has nothing to do with evil or good. Only those who are afraid of occultism, who see occultism as a threat to their beliefs, can say that these powers are evil, a basic retoric trick to demonize your enemies or those you are afraid of.
"Study of a deeper spiritual reality that extends beyond pure reason and the physical sciences", that does look like the christian beliefs to me.
18 Aug 09
Originally posted by KellyJayhi Kelly,
Care to post that definition you are refering to?
Kelly
I think this is an example of where a broad defintion of a word can cover a range of meanings. Wouldn't you say? I think we all have a GENERAL idea of what 'occult' means .
I also think I know what Bosse is trying to get at. It may be a bit of a cheap shot but I think it is well within the bounds of decency of him to make it. What do you think?
18 Aug 09
Originally posted by karoly aczelI posted the definition.
hi Kelly,
I think this is an example of where a broad defintion of a word can cover a range of meanings. Wouldn't you say? I think we all have a GENERAL idea of what 'occult' means .
I also think I know what Bosse is trying to get at. It may be a bit of a cheap shot but I think it is well within the bounds of decency of him to make it. What do you think?
Cheap shot?!
18 Aug 09
Originally posted by Bosse de NageHey in my opinion it was a broad definition which is currently being subject to some change . Its 'street' definition is currently broadly understood. At least in my neck of the woods .(Brisbane,Australia)
I posted the definition.
Cheap shot?!
You were well within your rights to make that comment, (as I reffered to) 🙂
18 Aug 09
Originally posted by Bosse de NageThe dictionary definition you have given so far, does not really capture the full essence of the common usage of the term.
According to the dictionary definition of 'occult', Fundamentalist Protestants and traditionalist Catholics are occultists.
It's obvious, no?
However, the word almost certainly has different meaning to different people. I suspect that those who call themselves 'occultists' have a very different picture from the rest of us.
Your quote from Billy Graham shows that for some it has connotations of evil. I suspect though that he did not actually think through the meaning of his statement but simply wanted a word that sounded scary.
Also I must ask, if someone believes in the existence of ghosts or other popular supernatural phenomenon, are they 'occultists' or must one actively wish to study or communicate with such phenomena? I know plenty of Christians who believe in the existence of ghosts, magic, and other supernatural phenomena that are not specifically part of the Christian religion. Clearly Billy Graham is no exception.
18 Aug 09
2 edits
Originally posted by twhiteheadUnless God is manifest, attempting to communicate with God is occultism, by definition.
Also I must ask, if someone believes in the existence of ghosts or other popular supernatural phenomenon, are they 'occultists' or must one actively wish to study or communicate with such phenomena? I know plenty of Christians who believe in the existence of ghosts, magic, and other supernatural phenomena that are not specifically part of the Christian religion. Clearly Billy Graham is no exception.
A ghost that appears to you is not hidden, so I guess occultism doesn't apply 😕 If you try to call one up, on the other hand, the case is clear.
18 Aug 09
3 edits
Originally posted by twhitehead============================
The dictionary definition you have given so far, does not really capture the full essence of the common usage of the term.
However, the word almost certainly has different meaning to different people. I suspect that those who call themselves 'occultists' have a very different picture from the rest of us.
Your quote from Billy Graham shows that for some t are not specifically part of the Christian religion. Clearly Billy Graham is no exception.
I know plenty of Christians who believe in the existence of ghosts, magic, and other supernatural phenomena that are not specifically part of the Christian religion. Clearly Billy Graham is no exception.
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I doubt that you can back up that Billy Graham believed in ghosts.
He may have acknowledged the practice of magic.
But that Graham believed that the departed spirits of dead persons had any interaction at all with the living, as the typical understanding of "ghosts" is, ....? I wouldn't hold my breath while you searched for evidence of Billy Graham having believed in that.
That is unless you consult with some libelous, anti-Christian Gospel, skeptical website claiming to know all about it.
18 Aug 09
Originally posted by Bosse de Nage===============================
According to the dictionary definition of 'occult', Fundamentalist Protestants and traditionalist Catholics are occultists.
It's obvious, no?
According to the dictionary definition of 'occult', Fundamentalist Protestants and traditionalist Catholics are occultists.
It's obvious, no?
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What does "the dictionary" say about a Sensationalist ?