Originally posted by robbie carrobie
well if my house goes on fire i know who to call, ghost busters, for that's what this argument amounts to, a non reality. Tell the forum Jack, what era of peace has been ushered in by your Messiah?

What on earth are you talking about? I wasn't talking about the final solution - whatever your particular philosophy fantasizes about that. I was talking about the mundane challenges of every day existence like freedom of conscience and the right to live and work without being persecuted. Political rights - these are guarded and guaranteed by political actions. I think there is a lot of ground that can be covered from where we are at as a civilization now and utopian fantasies of peace and love and flower children. You don't pull an ass out of a ditch from both ends. We need to start somewhere. All I'm saying is that we are all responsible for reaching out a hand to help.

Originally posted by whodey
You make some assumptions here. You assume that by electing "W" President, the general popluce was asleep at the wheel. However, with Obama the populace rose up and demanded better some how. So tell me, how is Obama different that "W"? Do they not both spend like drunken sailors? "W" passed one of the largest entitlement policies in US history and Obama ...[text shortened]... ple at its helm. The change needs to start from the ground up, not from the top down.

What were you reading? (Not what I posted.) I didn't say anything about Obama directly. Take your political axe elsewhere for the abrasion it so desperately needs. I didn't say a word about policy. I was talking about what was expected of the USA by the rest of the world. I was talking about the promise of the founders. I was talking about the responsibilities of citizenship. I was talking about political action being required spiritually. I was talking about starting from the ground up as a political action. People are changed by the example of other people working along side of them to make a better world. Not by hermits who live in the woods waiting for the sky to open up and shower them with beautiful visions.

Originally posted by whodey
Most are only interested in the US's money.

Except when they are being oppressed because they belong to a particular group. Then they whine like babies and call for action in the name of humanity.

Originally posted by TerrierJack
What on earth are you talking about? I wasn't talking about the final solution - whatever your particular philosophy fantasizes about that. I was talking about the mundane challenges of every day existence like freedom of conscience and the right to live and work without being persecuted. Political rights - these are guarded and guaranteed by political a art somewhere. All I'm saying is that we are all responsible for reaching out a hand to help.

i really dont know what to say Jack. You start with what amounts to a political reference, the nobel prize for peace, launch into a tirade against those who are prepared to exercise their own consciences, irrespective of political fashions and dictates, and then when pressed upon to give some evidence, state that it was nothing to do with the nobel peace prize whatsoever, but to do with every day concerns. Forgive us if we seem confused. It appears to me that freedoms are not guaranteed through any political process , but through an appeal to law, which is something quite different, for the political process can 'frame injury by decree', just as much as it can guarantee those freedoms.

Originally posted by TerrierJack
Can you read, bubba?

you are still in the wrong forum, spanky

Originally posted by TerrierJack
I believe the world looks to America because of the promise contained in our founding documents

This is blatantly untrue. The vast majority of non-Americans know little or nothing about Americas founding documents and promises contained therein.
Peoples expectations of America are largely based on the fact that America is a noisy super power ie it is militarily and economically very powerful and also has a large proportion of the world media and the world medias attention.
Now that China is becoming economically more powerful and getting more media attention, more people will start looking at it and 'expecting' more from it too - its founding documents are virtually irrelevant.

Originally posted by twhitehead
This is blatantly untrue. The vast majority of non-Americans know little or nothing about Americas founding documents and promises contained therein.
Peoples expectations of America are largely based on the fact that America is a noisy super power ie it is militarily and economically very powerful and also has a large proportion of the world media and th ...[text shortened]... king at it and 'expecting' more from it too - its founding documents are virtually irrelevant.

Seconded.

Those aware of 'the promise contained in [its] founding documents' are likely to reflect sadly on how grotesque the USA appears in its light. There's also the amusing spectacle of Framer Fundamentalism, a thriving example of informal secular religion.