Spirituality
10 Feb 15
10 Feb 15
Originally posted by googlefudgeLike the OP reveals the issue is not proof the issue is your sin. 😏
No, you are the one who gets 'spoon fed' [wrong] 'answers' so you can go around
thinking you know stuff, instead of actually getting down to checking things and
finding stuff out yourself.
The question before you is how to prove that the bible was written [inspired by] by
god?
To do this requires both that you prove a gods existence, and that ...[text shortened]... ve it's true FIRST.
And any claim that the bible 'proves' itself true is a logical fallacy.
- Joined
- 31 May 06
- Moves
- 1795
10 Feb 15
Originally posted by RJHindsNo.
Like the OP reveals the issue is not proof the issue is your sin. 😏
Sin is the repugnant and idiotic idea that morality comes from god and that
disobeying gods rules/laws/commands is bad and will be punished by god.
If there is no god, then the whole concept is meaningless.
As we don't believe in gods, the whole concept is meaningless.
You must prove your god exists before sin becomes any kind of a relevant
concept.
- Joined
- 31 May 06
- Moves
- 1795
10 Feb 15
Originally posted by lemon lime
"Worship" is the wrong word to use when asking this question, because you should always remember who your audience is.
Satan knows what actually happened, and he knows who God is, so from this example alone it seems evident that knowing is not the same as worshiping. Most atheists can understand this distinction, but at the same ti ...[text shortened]... o matter how careful you are, they [b]will manage to find something wrong with what you say.[/b]
... many of them will now think I'm comparing them to Satan ...
No, that's actually an argument we use against many Christians belief that we can't know
god exists because that would violate our free will.
And yet here we have satan knowing god exists absolutely and still not worshipping god.
It's a perfectly reasonable point you're making there.
... they will manage to find something wrong with what you say. ...
Only if you actually say something wrong...
You know if you had just stopped with your point, and not gone on about how we would
miss-understand it you would have been sorted.
11 Feb 15
Originally posted by googlefudgeBut if the God of the Holy Bible and the Son of God exists then you are very likely to be eventually thrown into the Lake of Fire and Brimstone where you will be tormented day and night forever and ever.
No.
Sin is the repugnant and idiotic idea that morality comes from god and that
disobeying gods rules/laws/commands is bad and will be punished by god.
If there is no god, then the whole concept is meaningless.
As we don't believe in gods, the whole concept is meaningless.
You must prove your god exists before sin becomes any kind of a relevant
concept.
- Joined
- 31 May 06
- Moves
- 1795
11 Feb 15
1 edit
Originally posted by RJHindsSure. But if it's not the god of the bible that exists and it's in fact the god of the Koran, or the Torah
But if the God of the Holy Bible and the Son of God exists then you are very likely to be eventually thrown into the Lake of Fire and Brimstone where you will be tormented day and night forever and ever.
then you are equally screwed.
If there is a god who only spares those who use their 'god given' minds to determine that there is no
good reason to believe in a god and thus don't. In which case I'm fine, but you are toast.
You are making a very bad attempt at pascals wager... "What if you're wrong?"
Which is just about the worst and stupidest argument for believing in god/s that has been devised.
I have written numerous posts utterly trashing it, it's truly terrible.
And a testament to the power of faith to destroy peoples ability to function properly in that faith
took one of the greatest mathematical minds, who previously had been making great strides
in mathematical reasoning and creating valuable tools for modern science and turned him into
an intellectual minnow who published nothing more of value, and produced what is perhaps the
worst argument for belief of all time.
You really need to stop making these threats [as does every other theist] because they make you
look and sound epically stupid.
So you know how stupid the threat you just made sounds to us/me...
Watch this: "God is an Idiot: God's "Perfect" Plan" - JT Eberhard - Skepticon 7
EDIT: Also for any atheists who have ~30 mins to spare, it's well worth watching.
It's the closing talk of the conference and is rather funny, as well as right on point.
We have no reason at all to suppose that your religion or god is true and every reason not to.
Your religion is laughably stupid and would be funny if it didn't do so much harm.
11 Feb 15
Originally posted by googlefudgeI am not making any threat against you for I have no power to carry them out. I was just passing on a warning from the Holy Bible for all unbelievers and workers of iniquity. 😏
Sure. But if it's not the god of the bible that exists and it's in fact the god of the Koran, or the Torah
then you are equally screwed.
If there is a god who only spares those who use their 'god given' minds to determine that there is no
good reason to believe in a god and thus don't. In which case I'm fine, but you are toast.
You are making a ...[text shortened]... on not to.
Your religion is laughably stupid and would be funny if it didn't do so much harm.
11 Feb 15
Originally posted by RJHindsYou're pulling my leg, right? All of us are influenced by Satan. Some of us are better at resisting that influence than others, but in one way or another we've all succumbed to it. The "mystery of iniquity" is still a mystery to me, I still don't fully understand it.
Yes you are right. There is probably no perfect word for that audience. Would saying they are influence by Satan be better?
There is no god. There is no satan either. They're both inventions of ignorant minds in the long ago past. Now we have the capacity to think for ourselves. Some may cling to the stories they were told as children, others think and reason as adults. And of course they look closely at any new idea, not just accepting anything "because XX says so".
Australian aborigines have a fascinating set of creation stories. Today's people accept them as just that, stories. They pay them the proper respect as part of their ancestors' culture, but they certainly don't live their lives by them.
Originally posted by lemon limeThere may have been times in the past that I was influenced by Satan and there may still be times in the future that that could be the case, but I do not believe at the present that to be true. In the future I hope to be able to resist Satan's influence.
You're pulling my leg, right? All of us are influenced by Satan. Some of us are better at resisting that influence than others, but in one way or another we've all succumbed to it. The "mystery of iniquity" is still a mystery to me, I still don't fully understand it.
Submit therefore to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you.
(James 4:7 NASB)
11 Feb 15
Originally posted by KewpieI have heard of the Australian aborigines, but I am not aware of their culture or legends. However, from what you have said they apparently know that this world was created and did not happen by chance. I would bet that all the creation stories are a distortion of the one in the Holy Bible.
There is no god. There is no satan either. They're both inventions of ignorant minds in the long ago past. Now we have the capacity to think for ourselves. Some may cling to the stories they were told as children, others think and reason as adults. And of course they look closely at any new idea, not just accepting anything "because XX says so".
Austr ...[text shortened]... respect as part of their ancestors' culture, but they certainly don't live their lives by them.
I am certainly a redneck, but that does not me I have an ignorant mind and lack intelligence.
The fool has said in his heart, "There is no God."
(Psalm 14:1 NASB)
11 Feb 15
1 edit
Originally posted by RJHindsLook at the post right about your last one. This is why it makes no sense to tell them they're being influenced by Satan. Did Jesus say, go and find people who will trample all over your message? No. Does it say anything like that in Proverbs? No.
There may have been times in the past that I was influenced by Satan and there may still be times in the future that that could be the case, but I do not believe at the present that to be true. In the future I hope to be able to resist Satan's influence.Submit therefore to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you.
(James 4:7 NASB)
Persuasion works best if it's not over done, otherwise it can have the opposite effect.
Edit: I meant look at Kewpies post... but you've already seen it. Sigh... well, so much for my no so lightening fast reflexes. I'll have to be content with slogging along in permanent slow-mo mode.
11 Feb 15
Originally posted by lemon limeAre you saying you are not happy with my redneck methods? Suzianne has told me as much, but I guess once a redneck, always a redneck.
Look at the post right about your last one. This is why it makes no sense to tell them they're being influenced by Satan. Did Jesus say, go and find people who will trample all over your message? No. Does it say anything like that in Proverbs? No.
Persuasion works best if it's not over done, otherwise it can have the opposite effect.
Edit: I meant l ...[text shortened]... lightening fast reflexes. I'll have to be content with slogging along in permanent slow-mo mode.
