Originally posted by @jacob-verville
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Greetings Jacob, I love the Lord Jesus. My God is the Man Jesus Christ.
There are some interesting passages like Hebrews 12:1 that talk about the great cloud of witnesses. The cloud of witnesses are those Christians who are dead that go on to observe us and surround us.
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Yes, I take
Hebrews 12:1 like that too.
We believe in immortal souls, right, and we believe that God has sent angels to us with messages before and all manner of things along these lines...
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Christians should be careful not to be distracted from Christ. How very little is said in the New Testament about angels involvement with believers.
I would not dare say that no mention is made about angels in regards to Christians. I would say the greater emphasis by an exponential margin is about the believers' union with Christ. Do you agree?
Ie. Paul cautioning the
Colossians not to be led into worship of angels based on fleshly imaginations.
"Let no one defraud you by judging you unworthy of your prize, in self-chosen lowliness and the worship of angels, dwelling on the things which he has seen, vainly puffed up by his mind set on the flesh." (Col. 2:18)
"Come back from pre-occupation with angels to Christ." is the tone. Angels are real. But do not be sidetracked away from Christ because of them.
I do not think it is a stretch at all to believe the mother of God, Mary, who is presented as such in the Bible, would also have a special role as a Saint and be a member of this cloud of witnesses.
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She has no special role Jacob.
She was a saint.
But I am a saint also.
All those who have been placed in a holy position in Christ as sanctified and called
"saints".
Here we see all the disciples were SAINTS.
"Paul, a called apostle of Christ Jesus through the will of God, and Sosthenes the brother,
To the church of God which is in Corinth, to those who have been sanctified in Christ Jesus, the called SAINTS, with all those who call upon the name of our Lord Jesus Christ in every place, [whi] is theirs and ours." (1 For. 1:1,2)
All of the believers in Jesus Christ in the church in Corinth were the called
"saints". And some of them were in poor spiritual shape. They were still the called saints.
Not only were all the Christians in Corinth then
"saints". All those who call upon the name of the Lord Jesus Christ in
every place were also
saints.
The tradition of elevating certain Christians to "Sainthood" is not biblical.
Mary was sister in the Lord. She was not called "above woman" but "
among women". We should not pray to Mary or worship Mary. We should turn our hearts fully towards Christ the Head of the Body of the members of His Body.
Saying that this kind of thing is like... just synthesizing paganism with Christianity... even when this is an important, 2,000 year old aspect of the culture of Christianity seems very dismissive and precisely what atheist detractors say about us.
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Must cont. discussion latter Jacob.